Earnings Call Transcript
APPIAN CORP (APPN)
Earnings Call Transcript - APPN Q3 2025
Operator, Operator
Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Appian Third Quarter 2025 Earnings Conference Call. Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your first speaker today, Brian Denyeau from ICR. Go ahead.
Brian Denyeau, Investor Relations
Thank you. Good morning, and thank you for joining us. Today, we'll review Appian's third quarter 2025 financial results. With me are Matt Calkins, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; and Serge Tanjga, Chief Financial Officer. After prepared remarks, we'll open the call for questions. During this call, we may make statements related to our business that are considered forward-looking. These include comments related to our financial results, trends and guidance for the fourth quarter and full year 2025, the duration and impact of the current U.S. government shutdown, the benefits of our platform, industry and market trends, our go-to-market and growth strategy, our market opportunity and ability to expand our leadership position, our ability to maintain and upsell existing customers and our ability to acquire new customers. These statements reflect our views only as of today and don't represent our views as of any subsequent date. We do not intend to update these statements as a result of new information unless required by law. Actual results may differ materially from expectations due to the risks and uncertainties described in our SEC filings. Additionally, non-GAAP financial measures will be discussed on this conference call. Reconciliations of GAAP to non-GAAP financial measures are provided in our earnings release. With that, I'd like to turn the call over to our CEO, Matt Calkins. Matt?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Thanks, Brian, and thank you, everyone, for joining us today. In the third quarter of 2025, Appian's cloud subscriptions revenue grew 21% to $113.6 million. Subscriptions revenue grew 20% to $147.2 million. Total revenue grew 21% to $187.0 million. Adjusted EBITDA was $32.2 million. This quarter, Appian made big strides on our efficiency metrics. Our go-to-market productivity ratio rose to 3.5. This is the ninth consecutive quarterly increase. We keep getting more from our sales and marketing dollars, an intended outcome of our strategy over the last few years. In Q3, our weighted Rule of 40 score was 39, up from 31 last quarter. As a reminder, Appian's weighted Rule of 40 puts double weight on cloud subscriptions revenue growth compared to adjusted EBITDA margin. The AI revolution took an important turn this summer. Businesses started to realize that AI isn't as valuable unless it's connected to real work and that you need a process or a workflow to make that connection. The most important factor was probably the July MIT report that told us that 95% of AI implementations were getting no return. As MIT wrote, 'The standout performers are those embedding themselves inside workflows.' And people are getting the message. Looking at Google Search trends, the term AI moderately increased over the past 12 months, but the combination of AI in terms like process and workflow spiked this summer. News outlets are publishing headlines like 'why AI isn't delivering the value you expected' and 'good AI innovation means focusing on workflow, not cutting jobs.' This trend also matches my personal experience and customer conversations. I see corporations quickly losing interest in stand-alone AI deployments and favoring the use of AI in the context of a process. This new realization is not a surprise to Appian nor to you if you've been listening to our calls for the last couple of years. We have said consistently that AI forms one corner of an essential trio of technologies in which AI is dependent upon each of the others. I've never had trouble convincing people that AI is only as good as the data you give it. It's obvious that AI agents cannot research cases, reach conclusions, solve problems or get smarter without 360-degree access to data. Our data fabric remains the gold standard in providing data to AI without having to migrate it. Only recently have people started naturally agreeing with my second assertion that AI is only as good as the work you give it. AI will add more value if it works on the more valuable tasks. And the most valuable tasks involve many workers and many steps coordinated in a process. As such, process is an essential tool in connecting AI to meaningful work. With industry-leading process technology, we offer the missing link between AI and today's most important jobs. When you combine AI, data, and process, you can address bigger work and create bigger value. We call this serious AI. It's an exciting crossroads at which to do business, and we are not new here. Appian has orchestrated enterprise business processes for over 2 decades. We are recognized by industry analysts as a leader in process orchestration, business workflow automation, digital process automation, and most recently, the inaugural Gartner Magic Quadrant for business orchestration and automation technologies. I'd like to share with you a few examples of serious AI. First, a global pharmaceutical company and 7-figure cloud ARR customer manages its global anti-bribery and corruption practices on our platform. Appian already automates the company's highly regulated process for approving interactions with external health care practitioners and vendors. However, cycle times are slowed by the many human reviews the customer built into its process. In Q3, it purchased a 7-figure software deal to deploy Appian AI. Now our agents will ingest hundreds of thousands of requests, validate compliance and recommend a status. This major pharma company expects to speed up the critical process by 80% with Appian. Next, a U.S. military command became a new Appian customer in Q3 and will use our platform to automate end-to-end warehouse fulfillment processes. Upon receipt of goods, Appian AI agents will extract shipment data and open a case on our platform, so warehouse workers can validate the package and approve it for distribution. Meanwhile, back-office staff will track fulfillment status and coordinate logistics. Before Appian, the organization had prolonged distribution because its processes were disjointed and manual. Now the combination of Appian AI and data fabric will reduce processing time from weeks to minutes. Customers see strong quantifiable value using Appian AI in their core processes. Organizations have reported a 36% reduction in invoice processing times, 83% faster patient intake, 3x faster audit processing and 95% automation of the order management process. Good ROI, and they're willing to pay for it. Today, over 1/4 of our customer base pays for Appian AI. Of those paying AI users, nearly half use our AI-powered intelligent document processing or IDP. This is a really powerful offering. Appian IDP agents can ingest a wide range of complex documents from unstructured emails to medical reports and insurance claims. Our agents read documents with 95% to 99% accuracy, significantly better than the 60% accuracy rate of traditional document recognition technology. For example, one international insurer uses Appian IDP to optimize its underwriting processes and save millions of dollars a year. These strengths are why Gartner ranked Appian #1 in automated processing use cases for IDP in their 2025 Critical Capabilities report. Appian IDP agents take autonomous action. They explore data from across the enterprise to inform their decision-making on each new document. Once they contextualize and understand the incoming document, they launch actions in the form of Appian processes. For example, a global insurer purchased a 7-figure cloud software deal to automate its underwriting process and became a new Appian customer in Q3. Appian's AI agents will ingest emails and policy forms, open cases and automatically decline ineligible submissions. The insurer expects to improve its auto-declination rate by 20% and grow its written premiums practice to $10 billion within the next 3 years using Appian. Early in 2024, we launched an AI product for improving government procurement. You may remember it, it's called ProcureSight. We collected a ton of publicly available government procurement data sets and connected that to our process technology so our users could publish smarter RFPs. 96 U.S. government agencies and sub-agencies have adopted it so far. Now customers are purchasing advanced levels of the offering to embed the AI into their procurement workflows and connect it to both public and private data sets. For example, a U.S. Air and Space agency already automated its contract writing process with Appian technology. This quarter, it signed a 7-figure deal to automate additional phases of its procurement process with more prebuilt Appian solutions featuring AI. I usually talk about releases after they happen, but we have a big one in 10 days, and I'd like to share it with you now. We're launching a major feature called Agent Studio that's going to enable the most powerful agents we've ever made with easy code-free natural language configuration. This is a highly anticipated feature judging by the oversubscription on the beta program and the widespread pre-GA deployment. The technology is poised for broad usage on release to triage customer complaints, initiate credit checks and loan applications, and conduct background reviews. Most of you are familiar with Appian's multiyear quest to focus on the top end of our market. Appian has a particular advantage upmarket, and it shows in the data. Appian suits the needs of the executive buyer and the large enterprise and the mission-critical use case. Compared to last Q3, Appian booked over 50% more new 7-figure software deals. We're pleased with our federal sector performance this fiscal year, which grew faster than our overall business. Our upmarket strategy will continue to drive momentum in the U.S. public sector once the government reopens. I'll share 2 big wins from Q3. First, a major restaurant franchise operator plans to open 1,000 new locations next year. In Q3, it purchased Appian Cloud licenses and became a new customer after the Chief Technology Officer of a peer organization endorsed our platform. The customer's restaurant opening process used to take several months because the franchise and third parties worked across siloed systems. Now it will use Appian to unify the enterprise and create a comprehensive workflow to reduce opening timelines by 40%. Finally, a U.S. military branch and existing Appian customer is under executive mandate to modernize core systems and improve operational agility within a fixed time period. This quarter, it purchased Appian software to decommission and modernize flexible systems supporting its complex incident management process. Now Appian will provide a consolidated and more feature-rich application to manage hundreds of thousands of cases annually. Appian's serious AI offering and upmarket strategy continue to drive our growth while expanding margins. I think you can see in the fact that 25% of our customers now pay for AI and in our 50% increase in 7-figure deals. and in our 9 quarters of rising go-to-market efficiency and in our adjusted EBITDA margin of 17% the power and timeliness of our business model. With that, I'll hand the call to Serge.
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Thanks, Matt. I'll begin with a detailed review of our third quarter results and then finish with our outlook for the fourth quarter and full fiscal year 2025. Starting with our Q3 results. Appian exceeded the guidance ranges we provided in our key metrics of cloud revenue, total revenue and adjusted EBITDA. Strength in the quarter was driven by the traction we are seeing with AI and continued momentum in our focus on the high end of the market, as Matt mentioned in his remarks. Cloud subscription revenue was $113.6 million, an increase of 21% year-over-year. On a constant currency basis, cloud subscription revenue increased 18% year-over-year for the fourth straight quarter of growth in mid- to high teens. Total subscription revenue was $147.2 million, an increase of 20% year-over-year. On a constant currency basis, total subscription revenue grew 17%. Professional services revenue was $39.8 million, up 29% compared to the third quarter of 2024. As a reminder, services revenue can be volatile quarter-to-quarter. Subscription revenue represented 79% of total revenue compared to 80% in the year-ago period and 78% in the prior quarter. Total revenue was $187 million, an increase of 21% year-over-year. On a constant currency basis, total revenue grew 19%. Our cloud subscription revenue retention rate was 111% in Q3 compared to 117% a year ago and 111% in the prior quarter. Our international operations contributed 40% of total revenue compared to 36% in the year-ago period. Cloud net new ACV bookings were approximately 90% of total net new software bookings in Q3 compared to 88% in the prior year. Q3 cloud net new ACV growth was the strongest we've seen so far this year. Now let's turn to profitability metrics. I'll be discussing our results on a non-GAAP basis unless otherwise noted. Gross margin was 77%, unchanged from the year-ago period and compared to 75% in the prior quarter. Our subscription gross profit margin was 88% compared to 89% in the year-ago period and 87% in the prior quarter. Professional services gross margin was 34% compared to 30% in the year-ago period and 33% in the prior quarter. Total operating expenses were $113.6 million, up from $110.2 million in the year-ago period. The 3% growth in OpEx reflects both our continued focus on efficiency as well as approximately $6 million in marketing, training and consulting expenses that were originally forecast in Q3 but we now expect to incur in Q4. Adjusted EBITDA was $32.2 million versus our guidance of $9 million to $12 million and compared to adjusted EBITDA of $10.8 million in the year-ago period. This outperformance relative to our guide was largely driven by greater-than-expected revenue as well as the timing of expenses I just referenced. Net income was $24.4 million or $0.32 per diluted share compared to a net income of $1.8 million or $0.02 per diluted share for the third quarter of 2024. This is based on 74.6 million diluted shares outstanding for the third quarter of 2025 and 74.2 million diluted shares outstanding for the third quarter of 2024. Turning to our balance sheet. As of September 30, 2025, cash and cash equivalents and investments were $191.6 million compared to $159.9 million at the end of last year. For the third quarter, cash provided by operations was $18.7 million compared to $8.2 million cash used by operations for the same period last year. Turning to guidance. For the fourth quarter of 2025, cloud subscription revenue is expected to be between $115 million and $117 million, representing year-over-year growth between 16% and 18%. Total revenue is expected to be between $187 million and $191 million, representing year-over-year growth between 12% and 15%. Adjusted EBITDA for the fourth quarter of 2025 is expected to be between $10 million and $13 million. Non-GAAP earnings per share is expected to be between $0.04 and $0.08. This assumes 74.5 million fully diluted weighted average shares outstanding. For the full year 2025, we are increasing our guidance for cloud subscription revenue and total revenue. We're also increasing our overall adjusted EBITDA range for the year. Cloud subscription revenue is expected to be between $435 million and $437 million, representing year-over-year growth of between 18% and 19%. Total revenue is expected to be between $711 million and $715 million, representing year-over-year growth of 15% to 16%. Adjusted EBITDA is now expected to range between $67 million and $70 million for an approximately 10% margin at the midpoint of the range. Non-GAAP earnings per share is expected to be between $0.50 and $0.54. This assumes 74.6 million fully diluted weighted average shares outstanding. Our guidance assumes the following: First, we anticipate term license revenue to be flat on a year-over-year basis in Q4 and to grow in the mid-single digits for the full year. Second, we expect professional services to grow in the teens for both the fourth quarter and the full year. Third, total other income and interest expense will be approximately $3.2 million in Q4 and $13.8 million for the full year 2025. Fourth, our guidance assumes FX rates as of early in November. Finally, I want to explain how the ongoing government shutdown is reflected in our guidance. We've been cautious in our approach, and we have assumed a modest amount of disruption in our guidance. However, we do assume that the government will reopen in the coming weeks. Since we don't know how long the shutdown will last, we wanted to help you understand the impact on our guidance in a hypothetical scenario that the shutdown continues through year-end. In that scenario, we believe that there could be up to a $10 million impact versus this revenue and EBITDA guidance. The vast majority of this scenario impact will be to our term license revenue, a meaningful portion of which is related to renewals. We would expect only a small potential impact to cloud subscription revenue and professional services margin in this scenario. We are confident that whatever impact we might see from the shutdown in Q4 is just a function of timing. In closing, we're pleased with our Q3 results, particularly our continued improvements in profitability. We're energized by the opportunity we see ahead of us, and we'll continue to invest responsibly to maximize our long-term value. Now we'll turn the call over for questions.
Operator, Operator
Our first question comes from Sanjit Singh with Morgan Stanley.
Sanjit Singh, Analyst
I wanted to talk about the strongest cloud ACV bookings of the year that Serge mentioned this quarter. I was curious about the source of that strength—was it from a specific industry, a strong Fed quarter, or largely from enterprise? I’d appreciate some insight on that. I also have a follow-up question.
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Yes. First of all, I'm not going to attribute it to any sector. I think it was a broad strengthening. I think it's the continuation of our upmarket strategy and the traction we're getting with AI. That's where I'm going to have to attribute it.
Sanjit Singh, Analyst
Awesome. On the go-to-market side, we are observing sustained growth rates in cloud, and the margins are improving. There has been a multi-quarter enhancement in go-to-market efficiency. Using a baseball analogy, where do you think we stand in terms of our go-to-market transformation? Are we making good progress, or do you expect further improvements in go-to-market productivity as we head into next year?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Yes, Sanjit, let me take that. So we're very pleased with the progress that we're making. As you noted, we've seen cloud subscription revenue growth stable in the mid- to high teens on a constant currency basis for 4 quarters in a row, and we've continued seeing improvements in our go-to-market productivity metrics. And what that really means is just that our focus upmarket is resulting in higher sales productivity. And so we're making great progress in our move-up market. Where we are in terms of innings, I would say maybe fourth or fifth inning because what we're going to do now going into next year is returning to growth in our sales organization. So we focused our efforts on our existing sales organization over the last, call it, 12 to 18 months, and we've seen significant improvements in execution and focus and improvements. And now the goal is to return to growth and continue improving productivity while we also grow the size of the organization. Because to us, the key goal here is really to create a sustainable compounding growth engine. And for that, we need to both grow our coverage, which we have plenty of space to do as well as maintain and continue improving our productivity.
Operator, Operator
Our next question comes from the line of Steve Enders with Citi.
Steven Enders, Analyst
I guess I want to start on just the Fed side, and I appreciate the call out for Q4. But I guess I want to understand a little bit better just the impact that maybe you were seeing from the efficiency focus from the government this year? And maybe how does that play out in the big budget flush quarter in 3Q versus maybe how you were originally thinking about it?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Yes. Let me say that I love what's happened to the government overall in its purchasing patterns this year. And the shutdown is a temporary thing, but the changes the government has instituted in the way they approach technology are more long-lasting. Efficiency has become the priority. The government is willing to see software as the answer. It's open-minded about using AI. It's willing to do direct deals with an organization like Appian, like a midsized software firm. These are all enormously positive changes. And then we've got the temporary negative of the shutdown. So overall, I'm really bullish about the government business.
Steven Enders, Analyst
Okay. That's good to hear. And then I want to ask on AI Studio and that release coming out in the next couple of weeks. I guess what has been the feedback so far from the early customer program? And how are you kind of envisioning the monetization for that product as that starts to get rolled out into general availability for customers?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Yes. First of all, I want to highlight that we have not only the most oversubscribed beta program we've ever had, but also the most positive feedback from a diverse range of users. This is a highly anticipated release. We are at the forefront of what's possible with AI agents. I could provide more details, but I'll keep it brief. We are very excited about this release and believe it will significantly benefit many customers, positioning us as leaders in innovation in combining agents and processes. What else would you like to know?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Let me jump on modernization. So monetization will go in the form of continued expansion of our AI advanced tier. So Agent Studio will be available in the AI advanced tier. And as Matt mentioned, roughly 1/4 of our customer base is now paying us for AI. So incremental features like Agent Studio will continue pushing that number higher. And then secondly, there will be elements of consumption as a part of Agent Studio. And as customer use cases, in particular, drive, that will be an incremental driver of growth in the long term, but it's an important incremental lever.
Operator, Operator
The next question comes from the line of Raimo Lenschow with Barclays.
Raimo Lenschow, Analyst
Congrats from me as well. I had two quick questions, one for Matt and one for Serge. Matt, regarding AI and its adoption, we are clearly in a competitive situation. Many vendors are trying to establish their position and become central in this space. Can you discuss what you believe will be the key factors that distinguish those who can deliver results from those who are merely presenting marketing materials? I have one follow-up for Serge.
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Yes. Okay. So the AI market is going to be interesting in the next couple of years. First of all, I think it's essential to differentiate between those who are creating the AI and those who are creating a complement for AI. Our technology is explicitly intended as a complement like a car is to an engine. We mean to enhance the capabilities of AI and to bring that power into the hands of our customers. So specifically, we take that AI and we give it connection, which is to say we connect it to data across the enterprise, connect it to workers. We give it secondly, coordination, which is to say we tell it when it's its job, when does it take a turn, who does it give the work to when it's finished. That coordination makes it part of a valuable process. And finally, we give it governance, which allows for oversight and auditability and changeability and guardrails. Those are essential components, and they stake out process as a technology as being really essential for AI going forward. I think that realization began in the summer, but it's going to continue. And I think we're going to see process accepted as a complement to AI software. Now in terms of how we differentiate from others who would provide process software, I'd say we've got a natural advantage here in that we've been focused on process and data fabric for a long time. Lately, it's become obvious that those things are essential complements to AI, but we were in this and leading this long before it was known. Therefore, we've got a big head start over anybody who has seen the writing on the wall and is now going to scramble to try to create process software or a data fabric like we already have.
Raimo Lenschow, Analyst
Yes, that makes sense. Serge, regarding the profitability number this quarter, there was some timing involved, which is why we're looking at guidance for Q4. However, considering overall profitability performance, this will be a key area for evaluation. Without the timing differences, what path do you see us on? How do you feel about our direction now that you've been in the role for a bit longer?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Yes. Thanks for the question, Raimo. I think you're right. I think the better way to think about our profitability is to sort of zoom out from quarter-over-quarter dynamics related to timing and seasonality and focus on the full year. So we're guiding to EBITDA margin at 10% at the midpoint of the range, which we think is a significant milestone for us, particularly when you think about where we've come from over the last couple of years. That's really the credit to focus on efficiency and improving productivity across the company, especially in our sales organization. As we look going forward, the key for us is to develop sustainable revenue growth and continued margin expansion. I would say that as we think about next year, in particular, in the context of what we've done this year and how much we've exceeded our own expectations when it comes to margin, I would expect more modest margin expansion ahead.
Operator, Operator
Our next call comes from the line of Devin with KeyBanc Capital Markets.
Devin Au, Analyst
First one I have is I just want to dive into your international performance there. I think you mentioned the mix uptick in 40% total, which kind of implies growth in the 30% range, which is a very nice acceleration there. Any color you can kind of give us on what's driving the strength there? Any differences in types of sectors gaining traction? And are you perhaps seeing more uptiering or AI adoption in international versus the U.S.?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
This is a broad wave, but you're right, it's AI, and it's succeeding at connecting higher in organizations, having higher-level conversations, addressing larger projects, creating more value. We do that by connecting AI to real work and making it pertinent to decision-makers at the top of the organization. I've got to say that's the biggest driver.
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
I just want to mention that foreign exchange was also beneficial here because the dollar has weakened against foreign currencies. That's part of the reason, but it is certainly not the only factor.
Devin Au, Analyst
Yes. No, that's helpful. And then just one quick one for Serge. Professional services, the gross margin there, really strong, close to 35% in the quarter. Any additional color you can give us on what's driving that uptick? And how should we think about that level in terms of sustainable gross margin for professional services moving forward?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Yes. We're very happy with our performance in professional services, both in revenue as well as in margins. The way that I think about our professional services organization is that it's a highly strategic asset for us. Our customers appreciate the high-quality implementation, and that's why they're willing to pay a premium, and that's why we have the margins that we have. The other thing is that professional services drives ARR growth and increasingly AI adoptions because our customers are more likely to turn to our professional services for AI implementations. When it comes to margins, we are thrilled with the performance in this quarter. I will say that the margin is particularly high because we've exceeded our bookings expectations, and that's resulted in much higher utilization of our team. People are working weekends and not taking vacations. So maybe the 34% level isn't quite sustainable, but we think high profitability moving forward is also in the cards.
Operator, Operator
Our next call comes from Derrick Wood with TD Cowen.
James Wood, Analyst
Matt, we're seeing some software vendors move into forward deployed engineer models to help accelerate adoption. How are you thinking about the services model in the context of Appian and AI deployments and potentially lean in around FTEs?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
Our model has existed long before the term forward deployed engineer became popular, which I always found amusing. We have benefited as an innovator by focusing on customer success over the years. Customer success has always been a priority for us. This team has consistently driven innovation, allowing us to realize new technologies and showcase them to our customers. It has accelerated our progress, enabling us to implement new advantages for our user base more quickly. Appian is fundamentally a technology-driven organization. Our success has always stemmed from superior technology, and the customer success team has played a crucial role in delivering the benefits of that technology to our users. This approach also enhances customer retention, fosters expansion, builds better relationships with our clients, and creates a direct talent pipeline within the company. We are proudly a services-centric software organization, and this strategy has proven effective for us, especially in our role as innovators.
James Wood, Analyst
Great. And Serge, can you help us understand just the bridge between your cloud net revenue retention rate at 111% and cloud growth at mid- to upper teens over the last 4 quarters? Is the delta from migrations that aren't counted in the NRR? Or how should we think about the relationship between these 2 metrics?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Yes. Thanks for the question. So the net retention rate was 111%, which is stable compared to the quarter ago. We've talked a little bit about this metric in the past. Expansion from our existing customers is very important to us. Obviously, it's one of our key drivers of growth. But it's not the only one. We also go after new customers, and we've been very successful over the past year, in particular, in winning some large new logos straight out of the gate, which I find very impressive given where we are in our upmarket journey. The net ARR retention is a part of the growth story, but not the whole growth story. The other thing we've talked about in the past is that our net revenue retention is a bit backward-looking, meaning that we look at revenue over the prior 4 quarters for customers who had been with us in the 4 quarters before that. So it tends to lag trends in revenue. And that's why you can see a discrepancy between those 2 at times, but it has nothing to do with the migrations. We don't see very much in the way of migrations from on-prem to the cloud. In fact, we see continued healthy growth on-prem, which you also see this quarter.
Operator, Operator
The next question comes from the line of Jake Roberge with William Blair.
Jacob Roberge, Analyst
Just wanted to double-click into the expectation to grow sales headcount again next year. Can you talk about how you're expecting to balance those investments with just the continued margin expansion?
Srdjan Tanjga, CFO
Yes. As I mentioned, and I'll kind of go across the board, but starting, of course, with our biggest expense line, sales and marketing. We've achieved improvements in productivity and our efficiency metrics that you see over the last 12 or so months, roughly in flat headcount. That is sort of the right way to approach it because as you move upmarket, as you focus on better execution, we've also brought in new sales leadership. You don't want to be doing that while at the same time growing headcount. You want to do one thing at a time. Now we're at a moment in which we feel confident because we made significant improvement when it comes to our productivity that we want to return to what I would describe as moderate headcount growth. The key goal for us, again, is to build a sustainable growth engine. To do that, you need a large market, which we have, and then you need to expand your coverage while continuing to grow productivity. We've done well on productivity, and now we got to return to expanding coverage. As we think about it, obviously, we're not providing guidance today. But as we think about the mix between growth and margins for next year, we expect to deliver both.
Jacob Roberge, Analyst
Okay. That's helpful. And then we're hearing that this legacy app transformation opportunity is seeing a pretty meaningful uptick in interest right now. I know you've been building some new solutions in that area. Can you talk about how you're thinking about addressing that opportunity moving forward?
Matthew Calkins, CEO
First of all, that was not a completely clear question. There was some interruption on the line, but I believe I caught enough of it to respond appropriately. You're inquiring about the modernization opportunity, which involves transforming legacy applications into a modern platform. We aim to be a leader in this expanding market. I anticipate it will evolve into a significant new software market, and we are exceptionally well positioned for it. We've been involved in modernization for a decade and have executed several noteworthy and publicly acknowledged projects. The volume of such work is expected to increase significantly because AI facilitates the extraction and understanding of legacy applications, as well as their redevelopment on a new platform, specifically Appian. We have several advantages that will set us apart in this field. Firstly, if you're migrating an application from a legacy platform, you should choose a platform that is entirely modern, flexible, scalable, and feature-rich like Appian. Secondly, we approach the task of rebuilding an application in a highly collaborative manner. There is significant collaboration between AI and the developer, where AI suggests options and the developer can adjust them. We just demonstrated this technology recently, and I am genuinely impressed. It's unique in the industry. We're going to foster a dialogue, which is essential for crucial applications. This process is not merely a transfer of code from one platform to another; it involves reimagining an existing application, enhancing it, and potentially integrating it with others to create something that fits the present needs. This goes beyond basic translation. Even if AI could handle the entire translation, it would still fall short. It requires collaboration. The key to successful modernization lies in fostering rich collaboration so that legacy applications are not just ported over or translated but are recreated on a superior platform. This is our focus. I am enthusiastic about this market. We didn't elaborate much on it today in our prepared remarks because we needed to highlight our new launch with agents, but our excitement remains strong.
Operator, Operator
And this does conclude the question-and-answer session and the program. Thank you for your participation in today's conference. You may now disconnect.