Earnings Call Transcript - SDOT Q4 2023

Operator, Operator

Welcome to the Sadot Group, Inc. Q4 Fiscal Year 2023 Earnings Conference Call. Today's call is being recorded and all participants will be in listen-only mode. After management's prepared remarks, we will take questions. At this time, for opening remarks and introductions, I would like to turn the call over to Frank Pogubila, Sadot Group, Inc.'s Investor Relations Contact.

Frank Pogubila, Investor Relations

Thank you, Operator, and welcome everyone to Sadot Group, Inc.'s Q4 fiscal earnings 2023 conference call and webcast. Before we get started, we would like to state that this call may include forward-looking statements pursuant to the Safe Harbor provisions of the U.S. Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. To the extent that the information presented on this call discusses financial projections, information, or expectations about the business plans, results of operations, products or markets, or otherwise makes statements about future events, such statements may be forward-looking. Such forward-looking statements can be identified by the use of the words such as should, may, intends, anticipates, believes, estimates, projects, forecasts, expects, plans, and proposes. Although management believes that the expectations reflected in these forward-looking statements are based on reasonable assumptions, there are a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from such forward-looking statements. You are urged to carefully review and consider any cautionary statements and other disclosures, including the statements made under the heading Risk Factors in Sadot Group, Inc.'s most recently filed Form 10-K and elsewhere in documents that Sadot Group, Inc. files from time to time with the SEC. Forward-looking statements speak only as of the date of the document in which they are contained and Sadot Group, Inc. does not undertake any duty to update any forward-looking statements except as may be required by law. For this call, all numbers disclosed have been rounded to the closest thousand and percentages have been rounded to the closest percent. Unless otherwise noted, all numbers disclosed in this report are the amounts attributable to Sadot Group, Inc. and exclude the portion related to non-controlling interests. On this call, we will refer to Sadot Group, Inc. as Sadot Group or the company. With me on the call today are Sadot Group's Chief Executive Officer, Michael Roper; Chief Financial Officer, Jennifer Black; and Chief Investment Officer and Chairman of the Board of Directors, Kevin Mohan. Michael and Jennifer will be presenting prepared remarks related to Sadot Group's financials filed on March 20, 2024, and those documents may be found on the company's website, newswire feeds, and on the SEC's website linked from the Sadot Group's website at www.sadotgroupinc.com under the Investors tab. At this point, I'd like to turn the call over to Sadot Group's CEO, Michael Roper. Michael?

Michael Roper, CEO

Thanks, Frank. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us today as we present the results of our fourth quarter and full-year earnings ending December 31, 2023. Before diving into Q4 and the 2023 full-year results and highlights, I'd like to acknowledge that it has been a truly transformative first 16 months since Sadot Group refocused and retooled the organization to become an emerging player in the global food supply chain. Beginning with our initial focus on agri-commodity origination and trading, we've embarked on a journey of diversification and growth. Allow me to give you a few headlines before we dive into the specifics. First, our 2023 total company revenue rose to $727 million from $162 million in 2022. Second, our 2023 full-year adjusted EBITDA was slightly positive compared to a $2 million loss year-over-year for 2022. Third, our total assets increased from $27 million in 2022 to $178 million at the end of 2023. And lastly, we are now fully focusing the company on the agri-commodities business as we've made the decision to explore alternatives, including potentially divesting the company of its restaurant operations. So let's jump into the details. I'm pleased to announce that Sadot Group Inc. achieved total revenue of $727 million for the full year of 2023. This marks a significant increase over the $162 million generated in 2022, noting that we had only commenced our Sadot Agri-Foods subsidiary operations in November of 2022. To be more precise, the Sadot Agri-Foods division accounted for 98.7% of our total company revenue for 2023. This is an extremely significant point given where we were a year ago, where we are today and where we're heading. So where are we heading? Our vision is to become a global food supply organization focused on origination and trading of agri commodities along with investments that have the potential to help improve our trading margins. Aligning with this goal, I can announce that we have formally engaged listed associates in New York, specialists in the sale of restaurant concepts, to facilitate and explore the divestment of our remaining restaurant and meal prep assets, which have had a material impact on earnings over the past year. With our remaining restaurants weighing on our P&L for 2023, I am pleased to report that we recorded a full-year positive adjusted EBITDA of $89,000 for 2023 compared to a $2 million adjusted EBITDA loss for 2022, a pretty significant change. The adjustments to EBITDA were a series of non-cash items related to the restructuring of our legacy restaurant brands, our corporate name change to Sadot Group Inc., and overall financing strategies, among other items. While these charges did impact our bottom line, they were one-time charges essential for helping to build our long-term financial strength and growth opportunities for the company. We anticipate further non-cash items to affect our bottom line in the near future as we proceed with the sale of our restaurant operations, along with stock-based performance expenses as part of our consulting agreement with Aggia FC LLC and with respect to our agricultural operations. Focusing on Sadot Agri-Foods, the business unit serves as our economic engine characterized by high dollar volume with narrow margins, which is typical for the agri commodity trading industry. In 2023, Sadot Agri-Foods generated $718 million in revenue and $0.3 million in net income for the company. You may have noticed that we've transitioned from disclosing monthly revenue numbers to a quarterly reporting framework to better align revenues with the company's margins and profitability to present a more precise financial overview. It is also important to note that we trade exclusively in Agri-Foods for human and animal consumption, including soy, corn, wheat, oils, and oilseeds. The trades typically range in physical size from 130 to over 78,000 metric tons or $35,000 to $45 million per trade, and we averaged over 20 trades per quarter over the past year. In order to expand our global reach, we've recently increased our trading offices, adding Sadot LatAm in Miami, Florida and Sadot Brazil in São Paulo to our existing locations in Singapore and Dubai. Moreover, we remain open to exploring additional expansion opportunities in the future. While expanding our global presence is essential, our growth hinges on access to trade financing capital. The growth of our top line revenues and bottom line margins is directly linked to increasing our access to trade financing, particularly to execute larger trades. With a year of financial reporting behind us, we are now poised to potentially access new and larger trade financing facilities. I cannot emphasize how important these trade financing facilities are to our growth. Access to such financing will provide us with the flexibility to pursue more and larger agri commodity trading opportunities, thereby increasing our top line revenue and potentially enhancing our margins and net income. In August 2023, the company expanded its footprint in the global food supply chain with the acquisition of approximately 5,000 acres of farmland in the Mkushi region of Zambia through our majority-owned subsidiary. This strategic move enables us to produce in-demand grains and tree crops such as soybean, wheat, corn, mango, and avocado, complementing our origination and trading operations to bolster our supply chain resilience and efficiency. Sadot's farm operations, not only stand-alone as a profit center, but it also serves as an integral part of the total supply chain operation. The crop allows the company to trade year-round and the underlying commodity to serve as collateral in case the market turns negative to help insulate against market fluctuations. I'm happy to report that we have recently signed an agreement with the Republic of Zambia's Food Reserve Agency, reaffirming the company's dedication to combating global food security challenges. This agreement aims to support the Zambian government's efforts to safeguard national food security and bolster the production of maize, a key staple in the region amidst growing demand. The agreement will facilitate the cultivation of high-quality maize. In support of this agreement, we have started our fall harvest of both maize and soybeans and, as of this recording, delivered over 96 metric tons of maize from 24 hectares with a full maize harvest of the remaining 513 planted hectares anticipated to take approximately seven to eight weeks to complete. The harvest for more than 348 hectares of soybeans will begin approximately three weeks from now and be completed in the mid- to late May time frame. In addition to Sadot Agri-Foods' current ongoing harvest, the company has also initiated a pilot program to help small farm owners in the region receive the central farm inputs such as seeds and fertilizers that they need in order to plant and farm their land. This contract farming program is in its pilot stage, engaging approximately 140 local farmers covering over 1,400 hectares. It's estimated that there are close to 3 million hectares, which actually converts to about 7 million acres of land in Zambia alone belonging to small farmers that are all in need of help to acquire the inputs needed to farm. The program allows for Agri-Foods to secure the inputs from local suppliers on credit terms, allowing the small farmers to pay for them at a later date with the farm product at the time of harvest. The company, in turn, collects a minimal management fee and increases its presence in the region. This initiative marks a significant contribution to local communities and the positive impact we can create as a large international company in rural Africa. Another new and exciting business line we've engaged in is carbon credits. Earlier this year, the company acquired a contract for carbon credits from an ongoing mangrove planting project in Indonesia. This move is aligned with Sadot Group's sustainability values and diversifies our product portfolio to open new markets and new opportunities. Carbon credits have become an inseparable part of agriculture and industry across the world, playing a major part in regulating and managing global environmental pollution. This asset is also part of the company's vision to potentially offer carbon-neutral commodity trades in the future. Overall, for 2023, Sadot Group reported a net loss of approximately $7.8 million, in contrast to a net loss of approximately $8 million in the previous year ending December 31, 2022. As previously mentioned, there were a number of one-time charges that significantly impacted our results. While these charges necessitated short-term financial adjustments, they are essential steps towards our long-term objectives. What's important to understand is that our economic engine, Sadot Agri-Foods, continues to perform, generating $9.3 million in operating income in 2023, further validating the company's strategic direction to focus on this business moving forward. While some tough strategic decisions were made this year that have impacted our financial results, we recognize their necessity in order to potentially achieve long-term benefits for the overall strength of the company and our valued stakeholders. We remain dedicated to executing our strategic vision and harnessing the opportunities the global food supply chain presents, and we eagerly anticipate building upon this momentum as we move forward. Now I'd like to turn the call over to our CFO, Jennifer Black, to review the financial performance of the company for the fourth quarter and full-year results for 2023. Jennifer?

Jennifer Black, CFO

Thank you, Mike. Before I begin, I'd like to note that our financial results for the year ended December 31, 2023, on Form 10-K were filed with the SEC yesterday, March 20, along with the press release out the same day. With that, I'd like to give an overview of the financials for the fourth quarter of 2023. Our Q4 2023 company-wide revenues increased significantly, totaling $171 million compared to $153 million for Q4 of 2022. The $18 million revenue increase was primarily due to sales revenue from our Sadot Agri-Foods division, which was only partially operational in Q4 of 2022. Sadot Agri-Foods completed 24 transactions in Q4 with the average revenue per transaction of $7.1 million, with the average cost of goods sold for that transaction at $7 million. These 24 transactions were completed across 16 different countries. The company incurred approximately $525,000 in stock-based compensation expense in Q4 2023. These expenses are primarily the result of stock-based performance expenses as part of our consulting management agreement with our consultant, Aggia. Now let me turn to the overall financial picture for the Sadot Group for the full year ending December 31, 2023. For the year ending December 31, 2023, our company-wide revenues significantly increased and totaled $727 million compared to $162 million for the prior year ended December 31, 2022. The $565 million increase is primarily attributed to the commodity sales revenue generated by Sadot Agri-Foods. Our adjusted EBITDA was a positive $89,000 in 2023, as compared to a loss of $2 million in 2022. I would now like to further discuss the financials for our two operating divisions of Sadot Group Inc. As Mike mentioned earlier, the company's main revenue and margin driver is Sadot Agri-Foods, consisting of our origination and trading operations as well as our farming operations in Zambia. Sadot Agri-Foods generated commodity sales revenue of $718 million for the year ended December 31, 2023, as compared to $151 million in 2022. The vast majority of the increase was due to its origination and trading operations with the farming operations contributing to a negligible amount. Our Sadot Agri-Foods 2023 net income was $9.3 million. Moving on to the company's legacy restaurant operations consisting of Pokémoto, Muscle Maker Grill, and Superfit Foods, the division generated revenue of $9.2 million for the year ended December 31, 2023, compared to $1.1 million through December 31, 2022. This decline in revenue generated was mainly due to the closing and refranchising of our corporately owned restaurant locations. The restaurant division reported a loss of $2.8 million in 2023 compared to a loss of $3.3 million in 2022. As of December 31, 2023, we had a cash balance of $1.4 million compared to a cash balance of $9.9 million as of December 31, 2022. This decline is a deliberate outcome of our strategic shift away from the restaurant business towards the agri commodity trading sector. Historically, as a restaurant company, there was a limited use for our cash reserves. However, with our new focus, the deployment of cash is intrinsic to our business model for generating revenue and margin. Instead of maintaining a large cash balance, our priority now is to actively utilize our cash to drive growth and profitability. This strategic approach aligns with our core objective of maximizing returns and creating value for our stakeholders. It is notable that our total assets increased from $27 million in 2022 to $178 million by the close of 2023. This substantial increase is attributed to strategic initiatives, such as the acquisition of the farm by our majority-owned subsidiary, accounts receivable related to trade and forward sales contracts for future delivery. These developments have significantly fortified our balance sheet, reflecting the strategic investments we have made to bolster our operations. While it is true that our cash reserves decreased by $8.3 million, it is essential to underscore that our overall asset base rose by $151 million. This shift underscores our commitment to deploying capital strategically to enhance our financial position and drive sustainable growth. It is important to remember that we continue to grow our overall revenue, increasing our working capital surplus, and building our balance sheet, all while making significant strategic changes in the company. With that, I'd like to turn the call back over to Michael Roper.

Michael Roper, CEO

Thanks, Jennifer, and thanks for that financial overview. In closing, I want to express my gratitude to all our investors and stakeholders for joining us today and for your continued support. Our 2023 full-year earnings call has shed light on a remarkable journey over the past year, showcasing our emergence as a key player in the global food supply chain. We've witnessed positive growth, particularly in our Sadot Agri-Foods division, despite facing challenges along the way. Over the past six months, we've implemented our announced strategy to convert all of our corporately owned and operating locations into franchised-owned locations. We believe this strategy will position the division once complete, to potentially divest the restaurants. We believe this approach underscores our commitment to focus on our core operations and drive long-term value for our shareholders. We are currently evaluating additional opportunities in the global farming, trading, processing, shipping, and distribution to increase our market share and operational footprint. I'm proud of the resilience and dedication demonstrated by our team whose hard work has propelled us forward amidst a dynamic landscape. As we move forward, we remain steadfast in our strategic vision, exploring new opportunities and partnerships to further strengthen our position in the market. Thank you once again for your trust in Sadot Group Inc. We look forward to the exciting journey ahead and delivering continued success for our investors, stakeholders, and the communities we serve. With that, please give us a few seconds to open the call for questions.

Operator, Operator

Before we get to questions from our selected analyst, Michael Roper and Jennifer Black would like to address some questions which we have received from our stakeholders. Also on the call with us is one of Sadot Group's Board members, Benjamin Petel. Mike, Jennifer, the floor is yours.

Michael Roper, CEO

Okay. Thanks, Alexa. Yeah, we got a few questions that came in previously that we wanted to go over and address before we turn it over to the live questions as well with the analysts. And so I'm going to read the questions and then we'll do the answers and then we'll transition after that. So the first question that we've received is how has adjusted EBITDA calculated? And why should we use this number? So I'm going to let Jennifer answer that one.

Jennifer Black, CFO

Okay, Mike. So we define adjusted EBITDA, and we start with net loss, and then we adjust for a few things like depreciation, amortization, net interest income and expense, income taxes, impairment expenses, stock-based consulting expenses, other income, change in fair value of stock-based compensation, gains on extinguishment, warrant modification expense, and gain on fair value measurement. These items are removed because they're either one-time transactions or their non-cash transactions that have impacted our net loss position. We believe that adjusted EBITDA, which is a non-GAAP measure, is a useful metric for investors to understand and evaluate our operating results and ongoing profitability because it permits investors to evaluate our recurring profitability from our ongoing operations.

Michael Roper, CEO

Awesome. Thanks, Jennifer. Let me find the next question here. Here it is. How do the additional trading subsidiaries compete with or affect each other? So we're talking about Sadot LatAm, Brazil, the MENA region, those types of things. How do they compete with each other or affect each other? So basically, really the subsidiaries support each other. And our strategy is to establish these different trading offices in important production and distribution geographies across the world. They will work together to facilitate supply and demand as well as the specific needs of the different locations. So, for example, our most recent subsidiary established in Brazil actually sources commodities for our Dubai office, which in turn may supply the Asia area. So they're all kind of interacting and supporting each other without necessarily being in competition. By expanding our global footprint, this plays a vital role in our overall diversification, allowing us to mitigate risks and enjoy multiple options rather than just relying on a limited client basis. Again, we're spread out across the world. There are different opportunities that pop up all the time. And don't forget that each one of our individual subsidiaries not only can trade internationally but also trade domestically, as well, right? So LatAm, that's in the central area, they can trade throughout Latin America, Central America, South America, and North America. They can trade and move product all over the world as well, just as an example. So there is no real competition against those different areas. Let's see the next question. Why has your cash on hand decreased year-over-year? And again, I'll throw that back towards Jennifer.

Jennifer Black, CFO

All right. Thanks, Mike. So this one, we've made multiple investments since we started our strategic pivot about 16 months ago. I mean, you can see this by looking at the increase in the balance sheet. We're investing in business to expand our operations and our business verticals. For example, we purchased the farm in Zambia for cash. We also deployed cash into other various trades with cycles that are throughout the trade process. Many of our trades require capital components and contributions from the company to execute those. And just like Michael was just talking about, we also expanded our trading areas to include Brazil and LatAm. Lastly, we also changed the company name symbol, and we launched a new strategic direction. All of these areas are where capital has been deployed. The decline in cash on hand is a deliberate outcome of our strategy shift away from the restaurant business towards the Sadot Agri-Foods division. The deployment of cash is intrinsic to the company's business model for generating revenue and margins.

Michael Roper, CEO

Okay. Thanks, Jennifer. Fourth question that we see here is how can the company increase its overall margins? And then more specifically on the actual commodity trades being executed today? So how do we increase margins basically, right, at the end of the day? So look, I think there are a few things to talk about here. Overall, I think it's important to remember that we are building a business, right? And we are in expansion mode. So it's not an established business yet, right? But it's new, and we're building this thing. We're building a very large corporation that's out there. This takes some upfront expenditures that may not have an immediate impact on revenues and profits. For example, the farm in Zambia. The farm is a seasonal component of its operations, meaning there's an upfront expense that the products that you put in, like planting, will yield returns at a later date. Again, we're seeing that in Zambia now as we've just started the major harvest of maize and soybeans that will be completed over the next few months. The contract farmers also begin their harvest later, which again brings in revenue throughout the later months. We did incur expenses, not only getting the farm integrated into the overall company but then also incurred expenses for planting, for example. So again, paying money upfront. Some of these things have a little bit of delay to come in. Now we're in those cycles as we've started our harvest for the farm. Another example would be the Brazil office. As we build up the team and infrastructure, you have to spend that money upfront, and then we'll start to execute trades. We're getting into that mode where we should start seeing some trades now starting to come through the Brazil office as well. For trades, specifically, this can fluctuate depending on the season, the type of commodity, market conditions, shipping costs, etc. We're in the process of looking to add different types of commodities to our portfolio, such as vanilla, lentils, and peas, just as an example of the diversification we're looking for. In addition, we want to continue to open new trade areas beyond our current MENA, LatAm, and Brazil areas. This will all allow us to shift between regions as market conditions fluctuate. Again, we're going to be able to sell and do business in Brazil while conditions may not be favorable elsewhere. So we will be able to move around between all these different areas by expanding in these different roles, and that all combined should help drive some of the margins in the business. So I think that was the last of the pre-questions, if you want to say, that we received. So Alexa, do you want to turn it over to the different analysts?

Operator, Operator

Yes. Thank you, Mike, Jennifer. We will go ahead and take the first question from our analysts, Aaron Grey with AGP. Do you have any questions, Aaron?

Aaron Grey, Analyst

Thank you for the detailed remarks and responses so far. I'd like to follow up on your last point regarding the commodity trading environment for the quarter. I noticed that gross margins were slightly negative or flat, based on average revenue and cost both around $7 million. Was there a specific large trade that led to these flat gross margins? It seems that gross margins in the commodity sector have been trending this way for the last few quarters. While I understand there can be volatility, it appears that trading activity may have increased. Can you clarify if this quarter’s performance was influenced by a one-off sale that affected margins, or was it an accumulation of multiple sales that contributed to this situation? Additionally, I’d like to expand on your earlier comments.

Michael Roper, CEO

Thank you, Aaron. I have a couple of points to make. Benjamin Petel is on the line, and I will let him speak in a moment. You mentioned slim margins. It's actually $7.1 million in revenue and $7 million in costs, so it’s not entirely flat, but we still have room for improvement. Benjamin, would you like to address this?

Benjamin Petel, Board Member

Sure, hi. Hello, Aaron. Nice to talk to you again. I think in general, looking at the environment we're in right now, there's a lot of strain or, I’d say, volatility in the trading world in general. There are a few factors contributing to that, kind of piggybacking on the tension in Ukraine, adding to that the tension in the Middle East and also China, which is the largest consumer in the world, has been showing signs of slowing down over the last quarter. But as Michael said, everything that was mentioned here before highlights that diversification is very important, and we plan to increase those margins basically by getting into different verticals of the supply chain and different products and geographies. Certain commodities or certain paths and geographies could be down or lower at times. This also depends greatly on the structure of how the trades have been done and the financing as also Michael alluded to. So I think it's a combination of factors, but this is definitely why we're striving and working hard to put in new parts of the supply chain, be it geographies, products, financing, etc., in order to mitigate risks and raise these margins.

Michael Roper, CEO

Awesome. Thanks, Benjamin. Aaron, what else do you have?

Aaron Grey, Analyst

I appreciate the color there, Michael, Benjamin. Second question for me, just the trade financing. Can you speak on the timing when that was finalized? I may have missed this, and any color in terms of the commodity transactions quarter-to-date in 1Q? We're almost done with the quarter, about nine days left. So just in terms of sales and margins, how that might have trended quarter-to-date versus Q4? Thanks.

Michael Roper, CEO

I’ll discuss the trade financing aspect. We are consistently working on trade finance and expanding our efforts. We have finalized several deals that we are currently leveraging. We estimate that we have secured between $15 million to $20 million in trade financing so far, and this amount continues to grow as we move forward. We are having ongoing discussions related to this. As for the current quarter, I don’t have specific numbers to share at this moment, but it seems to be a typical quarter overall. Unfortunately, I don’t have the detailed numbers available right now. What other questions do you have?

Aaron Grey, Analyst

Okay, great. Thanks. So to summarize, considering our current situation, can you clarify whether we're entering a longer-term phase with tighter margins? Do you believe that trade financing will help normalize this? Will you be able to adapt and target more favorable markets? Additionally, how should we view the balance between top-line growth and profitability as we approach 2024, given the current environment? A comprehensive outlook on this would be appreciated. Thanks.

Michael Roper, CEO

I believe we are agile and have the capacity to operate in various regions across the globe. We currently cover a significant portion of major markets, especially with Brazil starting to contribute. Our operations span the Americas and Latin America, and we have a history in the MENA region. This gives us a good amount of control and the flexibility to shift our focus as needed. For instance, if a particular commodity, such as soy, isn't performing well, we can pivot to other areas like vanilla or peas. This adaptability allows us to navigate through different commodities. When analyzing seasonal trends and incorporating elements of trade finance, it becomes clear that they all play a role in our business dynamics, contributing to the inevitable fluctuations we experience. I think Kevin wanted to add something at this point.

Kevin Mohan, Chairman

Yeah, Aaron, it's Kevin. No, I was just saying, I think that another thing that's really going to be critical for our go forward is to continue to add these trade lines. If you look back at the history of this company, we kind of started off by doing a lot of net offs and back-to-back. I think that the company is now sort of transitioning to something that's a little bit more traditional. As we implement that strategy and grow that side of the business, we are definitely hoping that things are going to improve.

Michael Roper, CEO

Yeah. And the other thing to consider, Aaron, is that it's not just about trade financing. We also have supplier credit lines. While they are often grouped together in conversation, they are actually two separate areas. We are actively working on numerous credit lines with different suppliers.

Benjamin Petel, Board Member

If I could summarize for just one more second? Aaron, I think you used the word nimble, and we usually use the word agile, but I think that's really the main thing here is to be agile and to be able to seize opportunities that are in line with our strategy. If we see that there's a slowdown in our typical commodity cycles, which are very short term, and our return on equity is usually quite significant. We're dealing with very large volumes with a very large ticket size, of which there are limited margins to begin with. However, there are different products and geographies, as Michael alluded to, which we are very much involved in examining and in different stages of bringing into the group that will potentially do a lot to increase these margins and also secure different kinds of trades and flows that will make us not depend on one geography, one product, or one financing. So I think that agility is definitely the word, and we look forward to diversifying into these other areas.

Aaron Grey, Analyst

Thanks. Well, I appreciate the current detail and answers, guys. I’ll jump back in the queue.

Michael Roper, CEO

Okay. Alexa, do you want to go to the next?

Operator, Operator

Yes. Thank you, Aaron. We'll move to Tom Kerr with Zacks for questions.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Good morning, guys. Can you hear me?

Michael Roper, CEO

Yeah, we hear you fine.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

I have a couple of clarifications. Most of my questions have been addressed, but please hold on for just a moment.

Michael Roper, CEO

Does anybody have any jokes they want to tell while we…?

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Sorry about that.

Michael Roper, CEO

No problem, Tom.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Could you clarify what trade finance is? Who is providing it? Is it coming from multiple sources, such as a bank or private investors? Who is responsible for arranging the trade financing, and what criteria must be met to qualify for it?

Jennifer Black, CFO

I'll take those on. Do you want to go ahead, Benjamin?

Benjamin Petel, Board Member

No, no, please, Jennifer, please.

Jennifer Black, CFO

So these are various sources. It's not just banks; some are trade companies, and some are private. We combine all of them mainly because we don't want to rely on a single source. We aim to diversify this just like we do with everything else. You really shouldn't put all your eggs in one basket. Therefore, we have different sources for that. Benjamin, would you like to add anything?

Benjamin Petel, Board Member

No, I think that basically covers it. Again, it is a very vast kind of term trade finance. In our line of business, often it could also come from the counterparts, either suppliers or customers, where you have different terms with them where, in essence, they're providing you with the finance to do the trade depending on the way you negotiate it and the timeline. In the banking or institutional world, there are banks that provide their funds, and then there are private or pseudofamily offices and so on that also are involved in this business. We have a blend of some of those at the moment and are always looking to find more that fit within our matrix of finance and what we're looking for.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Got it. And the $15 million to $20 million you referenced, that's just the collective number of all those sources you mentioned?

Jennifer Black, CFO

That's correct.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Okay. And back to the margin, just to beat that dead horse for a second. We had talked about 3% margins in that commodity business over time or that's a goal of 3% or better. I know you guys aren't providing guidance, but is there a timeframe perhaps we can look for that 3% goal? Is it 2024, 2025, or any other color on that?

Kevin Mohan, Chairman

Well, I think, first of all, we were aiming for margins between 1% to 3%, which is what we've talked about historically. However, there are many creative ways for a smaller company like ours to achieve much higher margins than that. There may be times when we have higher-margin deals, but also quarters where margins are lower. The goal is to balance these fluctuations throughout the year as conditions change, whether due to market shifts, weather, or trade finance opportunities.

Benjamin Petel, Board Member

I will continue if possible. I won't give a date here, but I believe that entering into new areas will help us not only hedge or sell against market volatility but also increase margins at every stage. For instance, if we were to expand into shipping, which we are not currently involved in, it could already make a significant difference if we had a shipping division to help mitigate shipping costs, since those are subject to fluctuations based on market conditions. This is what we're aiming for; we want to avoid depending on favorable market conditions for commodity prices. Where we find unpredictability, we need to diversify and explore new products, new geographic areas, and new sectors that will collectively enhance our margins to achieve our goals.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Great. That's helpful. And last question for me on the restaurant business. Can you kind of give us any more color on where we are in that process? I mean, do you have to wait for those corporate things to be refranchised? Or is there strong interest? I mean, are you guys looking at bids or what inning are we in?

Michael Roper, CEO

Sure, I'll follow up with you on this. There were always two phases in evaluating the restaurants. The first phase involved converting corporate locations into franchise locations, which is nearly complete. We still have a few to finalize, but the bulk of the work is done. This prepares the restaurants for us to bring in someone to assist with the next steps. We have engaged a firm, listed and associates, which specializes in selling restaurant chains and has been in the industry for about 40 years. Recently, we moved into the second phase, which involves divesting these restaurants. We hired them recently, within the last month or so, and we are currently setting up the data room and preparing necessary documentation. There has already been some interest, and we have initiated discussions. However, I don't have a specific timeline to share, except to say that this is a priority for us, and we are actively working on it.

Kevin Mohan, Chairman

I would like to add that Lecithin is very specialized in this particular business sale and has deep knowledge about brands. They are located in the Northeast, and we have had a long-standing relationship with them. In fact, they were the firm from which we acquired Pokémoto. There was considerable interest from many bidders when we initially purchased it, but after interviewing several other firms, we felt it made sense to partner with Lecithin, and we are very confident in that decision.

Tom Kerr, Analyst

Great. That’s all I have for this morning. Thanks.

Michael Roper, CEO

Okay. All right. I think that's basically it. Alexa, do we have anything else that's out there from an analyst perspective or questions?

Operator, Operator

That is all. I believe that concludes our Q&A portion of this call. Mr. Roper, any final comments?

Michael Roper, CEO

Okay. Yeah. Just I just want to thank everybody again as always. We've got a lot of things that are changing in this business. We're growing it, and it's pretty exciting. We've obviously started our farm stuff with the harvest in Zambia, which is pretty exciting. I don't know if anybody saw, but we had the President of Zambia actually on our farm this week, doing some press work and some festival activities as well. So getting some high-profile visits from people as well that are out there. So very exciting stuff and more to come soon. I appreciate it, everybody.