Earnings Call Transcript - TWI Q3 2024

Operator, Operator

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to Titan International, Inc.'s Third Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. It is now my pleasure to hand it over to Alan Snyder, Vice President of Financial Planning and Investor Relations for Titan. Alan, the call is yours.

Alan Snyder, Vice President, Financial Planning and Investor Relations

Thank you. Good morning. I'd like to welcome everyone to Titan's third quarter 2024 earnings call. On the call with me today are Paul Reitz, Titan's President and CEO; and David Martin, Titan's Senior Vice President and CFO. I will begin with a reminder that the results we are about to review were presented in the earnings release issued yesterday, along with our Form 10-Q, which was also filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission yesterday. As a reminder, during this call, we will be discussing certain forward-looking information, including the company's plans and projections for the future that involve risks, uncertainties, and assumptions that could cause our actual results to differ materially from the forward-looking information. Additional information concerning factors that either individually or in the aggregate could cause actual results to differ materially from these forward-looking statements can be found within the safe harbor statement included in the earnings release attached to the company's Form 8-K filed earlier, as well as our latest Form 10-K and Forms 10-Q, all of which have been filed with the SEC. In addition, today's remarks may refer to non-GAAP financial measures, which are intended to supplement, but not be a substitute for the most directly comparable GAAP measures. The earnings release, which accompanies today's call, contains financial and other quantitative information to be discussed today, as well as the reconciliation of the non-GAAP measures to the most comparable GAAP measures. The Q3 earnings release is available on the company's website. A replay of this presentation, a copy of today's transcript, and the company's latest quarterly investor presentation will all be available soon after the call on Titan's website. I would now like to turn the call over to Paul.

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Thanks, Alan, and good morning, everyone. The value that our products and our One Titan operating environment provide continues to support our third quarter results, which featured several positive aspects amidst the ongoing challenges in our end markets. One thing I truly enjoy is engaging with customers and end users, and I've been doing a lot of that lately. During these conversations, I often learn how our innovative products offer solutions that enhance their operations and truly set us apart from competitors. For several years, Titan has leveraged these valuable interactions and the feedback we receive to drive our future innovations, giving us a solid pathway for both the present and the future. I’ll delve into that further, but first, I'd like to provide some context on market conditions. Currently, we are experiencing one of the deepest cyclical downturns in agriculture that we’ve seen in many years. Despite the difficulties this presents, we have managed to maintain gross margins significantly above those during previous downturns. Our proactive management and cost control measures, along with a much healthier balance sheet, have allowed us to provide free cash flow above our expectations. David will elaborate on this in the financial discussion later. Now, I’d like to turn our attention to market conditions as we conclude 2024 and share insights on the key drivers for 2025, particularly focusing on the initiatives we plan to pursue to foster growth. Despite the tough end markets, we see several areas of opportunity that we are eager to discuss. One major topic that affects the macroeconomic landscape is next week’s presidential election. This is an important event regarding trade policy. Like most businesses, we seek clarity in policy direction as that significantly influences the import and export of many goods, including those related to agricultural products. Once the regulations are defined, businesses can adjust their plans accordingly, which we expect will lead to improved transparency in capital equipment demand and OEM production plans for 2025. In the short term, we anticipate a typical seasonal low for the fourth quarter, compounded by OEMs and dealers actively reducing inventories. The feedback we receive from leading OEMs highlights their intention to start 2025 with lean inventories, which allows them to better align production with demand. We have observed an initial round of destocking post-pandemic, followed by a second round this year as OEMs and dealers work to reduce their stock. For Titan, we view this as a positive development, as it may signal the end of this second phase of destocking and the low point of the cycle for us. It’s important to stress that we are not remaining idle during this process. In our earnings release, I provided several examples of our efforts to drive growth both now and in the future. We are pursuing various opportunities across our business, primarily driven by our connection to end users, which has contributed to the success of our LSW tires. We are actively promoting these tires in the market and achieving impressive results. However, until now, our LSW marketing has primarily focused on larger tractors and combines, and we see significant potential to expand into the mid-sized tractor market. Our discussions with farmers consistently reinforce that LSWs meet and exceed their expectations. The fuel savings we’ve observed are a significant performance metric, with field results often surpassing the predicted 10% to 15% range. This represents a substantial advantage for farmers and serves as a strong selling point. In addition to fuel savings, LSWs provide improved field performance, handling various conditions effectively, and importantly, they reduce soil compaction. As we intensify our targeting of the mid-sized tractor market, which encompasses about 25,000 tractors annually, capturing even a small portion of this market can significantly enhance our sales and EBITDA. Moving on from LSW, we are also excited about our new BPO technology this quarter. This flexible solution can replace wheels and operate machinery under various inflation pressures, even down to zero PSI. We recently released information on this technology, highlighting its advantages and applications, which align well with our consumer segment. Additionally, we are diligently working to regain our footing in the military market, where Titan had previously been a key supplier of wheels and tires. Considering the technologies I’ve mentioned, including LSW and VPO, we are optimistic about our potential to rejuvenate sales in this channel and contribute meaningfully to Titan once more. We remain focused on the synergies resulting from our acquisition of Carlstar earlier this year. Key opportunities include launching the first Titan branded high-speed trailer tire, a category where Carlstar previously excelled, and expanding Carlstar products into new regions opened up since the acquisition, along with offering new products across our entire consumer tire and wheel business. We see excellent opportunities for growth, not only in our traditional agricultural sector but also in this broader consumer market. An essential aspect of our strategy to improve results during this slower cycle is our aftermarket business. While we have discussed this in the past, I want to emphasize its role in offsetting some of the OEM-centric weaknesses we have experienced. We expect this segment to positively influence our overall results throughout all phases of the economic cycle. Year-to-date, on a pro forma basis including Carlstar, our aftermarket business has decreased by high single digits compared to a roughly 25% drop in OEM sales. Currently, aftermarket sales represent over 45% of our total revenue and continue to be advantageous for our overall performance. Shifting focus briefly to market conditions, starting with agriculture, farmer incomes remain under pressure here in the U.S. However, we are cautiously optimistic that two significant obstacles affecting purchasing activity, the election and interest rates, will ease as we enter 2025. Recent reports suggest that finished goods destocking may continue into early 2025. As mentioned earlier, the sooner this concludes, the more favorable it will be for Titan and our sales. Positively, we anticipate that tire and wheel orders will lead OEM production of finished goods due to this destocking impact, making it reasonable for us to expect some growth before OEMs see improvements. Furthermore, we expect our aftermarket business to remain robust as farmers continue using their equipment, driving demand for replacement tires. It's also worth mentioning that the equipment fleet is aging, leading to the need for replacements. Additionally, global population growth and increased protein consumption will contribute to the expansion of farmland planting acreage over the long term. We believe that the structural demand drivers remain intact. Coupling that with our one-stop shop strategy, we can provide a complete product catalog and solutions for both OEMs and the aftermarket. In our consumer segment, the aftermarket portion also shows better demand in comparison to OEMs. While interest rates have started to decline, they still exceed historic levels, which dampens categories such as recreational vehicles and riding mowers, alongside other consumer purchases. Consumers are feeling the squeeze from rising gas and food prices, which impacts discretionary spending. Looking forward, leading off-road equipment OEMs have indicated that further interest rate cuts and a cooling of inflation would positively affect demand. Turning to the EMC segment, the higher interest rates and elevated inventory levels are significant drivers affecting the market. While construction activity in Europe is somewhat stagnant, U.S. non-residential construction is expected to grow in 2024. Within the EMC segment, mining remains a crucial area for growth, particularly in the aftermarket channel. As I wrap up, I want to highlight an important initiative at Titan aimed at broadening our tire and wheel product portfolio through strategic supplier partnerships. Historically, Titan has focused on being a manufacturer and supplier of premium larger size products. As we enhance and expand our one-stop model from the Carlstar acquisition, we recognize that many of our customers seek products across various size ranges and categories. There are promising opportunities ahead to leverage our brand and strong distribution network while broadening our product offerings and ultimately increasing our market share. Collaborating with top suppliers across more market segments will benefit our customers and, in turn, will benefit Titan and its shareholders. In summary, despite ongoing challenging macroeconomic conditions, I am proud of the Titan team’s efforts, which have positioned us to navigate this downturn not solely by managing costs but also by laying the groundwork for future growth through product development. With that, I’ll now turn the call over to David.

David Martin, Senior Vice President and CFO

Thank you, Paul, and good morning, everyone. Revenues in the third quarter were $448 million with adjusted EBITDA of $20 million and free cash flow of $42 million. Relative to our guidance for the quarter, free cash flow was obviously a bright spot driven by our focus on managing working capital to appropriate levels for the down cycle. On the other hand, customer demand was even weaker than we anticipated in our Q3 guidance, which also weighed on our bottom line due to the impact of reduced fixed cost absorption. Stepping back, I want to reiterate a theme that Paul touched on, which is the relative success that we've had in navigating through what has turned out to be a very unusual deep cyclical bottom. 2022 was a similarly unusual year for us on the positive side of the ledger and while some reversion to the mean was expected, the downside we've seen has been rather unprecedented in recent memory. We took advantage of those excellent conditions in 2022 by aggressively paying down debt and growing our cash levels, while also continuing to invest in our product development, which has enabled us to enter this downturn with a net debt to leverage ratio of approximately 1x adjusted EBITDA. That resulting flexibility was a critical asset allowing us to acquire Carlstar while still maintaining a relatively modest interest expense level, and the key thing is our balance sheet remains solid. Carlstar has brought an important diversification to our business in the form of significant aftermarket business, which Paul touched on, and a larger consumer segment. Over the mid-to-long term, we expect those larger aftermarket and consumer segment contributions to be less difficult than the legacy Ag business. On top of this, we are driving product innovation and focusing on significant growth opportunities across all aspects of our business despite the current conditions. Turning back to the results for the third quarter, our adjusted gross margin was 13.3% compared to 16.4% a year ago. On a segment basis, ag segment margins were 9.6%, EMC was at 8.6%, and Consumer adjusted gross margin was 22.9%. Now this disparity isn't normal. Our margins in the EMC and the ag sectors are normally much higher, but our volume in our plants across the world were very low, which contributed to the lower margins that we saw this quarter. Our SG&A expense for the third quarter was $50 million or 11.1% of sales compared to last year at $34 million. This increase in SG&A can be entirely attributed to the Carlstar acquisition, particularly the distribution centers that are an integral part of the operating model for Carlstar. Our global management teams have watched spending very closely and have taken appropriate actions to reduce costs in the midst of a continuing inflationary environment. We have synergy opportunities going on that we're going to go into next year, and we're already on track with those synergies. R&D expenses were $4.2 million in the third quarter compared to $3.2 million a year ago. A portion of this also relates to the investments we're making in R&D and Carlstar. Our operating income was $2.8 million for the quarter, and our operating cash flow was $60 million. As I said earlier, we continue to drive strong working capital management, particularly receivables and inventory with both contributing positively to cash generation in the quarter. Again, this is a strong focus for our management teams and it is a discipline that's inherent in our culture. We also used our cash to fund our share repurchase program buying back just over 1 million shares for a total of $8.3 million for the quarter. Subsequent to quarter end, we also repurchased 8 million shares from our long-time equity holder, MHR. We think this was an excellent opportunity to drive value for our shareholders on a long-term basis. We will continue to have some flexibility to initiate open-market stock repurchases in the future, while we will use some discretion in the near term, as we manage cash flow. Net debt at the quarter end was $291 million or 1.9x trailing 12-month adjusted EBITDA, compared to $370 million or 2x trailing 12-month adjusted EBITDA on March 31, which was right after we did the acquisition of Carlstar. As was the case last quarter, the third quarter was also included significant increase in our effective tax rate compared to our normal levels. I discussed this last quarter, but I'll hit it again, since it had a significant impact on net income and EPS this quarter. It is important to help frame the drivers of the higher effective rate, which relates to foreign tax expense without benefit in the U.S. due to a lack of domestic income along with significant limitations on interest expense deductibility. We're working on a number of tax initiatives right now to drive more favorable tax rates in the future, heading into 2025. And so, I expect to see more normalized tax rates in the future. It is important to note, we have paid approximately $16 million in cash taxes through the first three quarters, primarily related to foreign income, and we anticipate that we'll pay approximately $22 million for the full year of 2024. So for the first nine months, our cash tax rate was approximately 42%, which is much more normal, but still higher than the normalized rates that I've talked about in the past due to the mix of foreign versus domestic income. Moving to our financial guidance for Q4, Paul and I both noted the fourth quarter will continue to be pressured due to the OEMs and dealer destocking we have discussed. It's normal to see a seasonal drop in Q4 and it's exacerbated by the near-term market impacts this year. So our guidance ranges for Q4 revenues of $375 million to $425 million with adjusted EBITDA of $0 million to $10 million. Our free cash flow is approximately breakeven, but we're really focusing hard on still driving free cash flow. It's important to have perspectives on our cyclicality in our business and we have deep experience managing these cycles. We are diligently managing through this trough, while keeping in our own recovery when it happens. Our financial condition continues to be solid and we're putting ourselves in a position to accelerate future performance. So thank you for your time this morning. Now I'd like to turn the call back over to the operator for our Q&A session.

Operator, Operator

Thank you. Our first question comes from Steve Ferazani of Sidoti. Steve, your line is now open.

Steve Ferazani, Analyst

Good morning, Paul. Dave, appreciate the detail on the call. I'd like to start by asking about the significant variability in the performance of the three segments pointing to the healthier margins in the Consumer segment. I mean, I know I'm not comparing it year-over-year, but if I compare it sequentially, I know it was down 10% sequentially, but your margins improved. Is there something different going on with the Consumer segment than the other segments? Can you help me with that?

David Martin, Senior Vice President and CFO

Yes. As we saw, the Ag margins obviously heavily weighed by the volume that are going through our global Ag plants, including EMC, which is also weighed down by that, similar plant levels there. But we had a really healthy mix of aftermarket business in the Consumer segment and that did hold very well through the quarter.

Steve Ferazani, Analyst

Is there significantly different seasonality in the Consumer business versus your other two?

David Martin, Senior Vice President and CFO

It's more even than what we see in Ag and EMC, keeping in mind EMC is a little different than Ag too, as we've talked about in the past. But their Q4 is very similar in terms of low volumes as they prepare to go into the spring cycle. So seasonally, Q4 is the weakest, but the variability is less.

Steve Ferazani, Analyst

Okay. That's helpful. You talked about various catalysts to get the Ag market going again. Ultimately, Paul, is it going to be crop prices that brings this market back? Do we have to wait for that, or is there any near-term drivers in your opinion, having been through these cycles before?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes, that's the main factor. We all recognize a strong link between farmer income and equipment purchases. I agree with your previous point. Titan has experienced many cycles, and we have substantial expertise in this area; we don’t overreact to market changes. However, we are taking proactive measures beyond just controlling costs. We are implementing the right changes in product development, which involves two main aspects. First, there's our internal development, which includes creating new products or extending existing ones. Additionally, we are exploring ways to broaden our portfolio through joint ventures, strategic partnerships, and our production facilities, focusing on underserved markets. With the merger of the legacy Titan and Carlstar businesses, our one-stop shop model has revealed new market opportunities that we previously couldn't access. We're using this time wisely instead of simply waiting for crop prices to rise, which could depend on various catalysts like interest rates or unforeseen events. We understand how to respond effectively during downturns, but we are also taking steps to prepare for the future.

Steve Ferazani, Analyst

Understood. Appreciate that response. I'm going to combine a couple of questions. One from a couple of weeks ago when you guys announced the share repurchase, Mr. Taylor, your Chairman, mentioned the potential of a large U.S. Army contract. I wanted to see if you could comment on that. I want to combine that with, Paul, you talked about expanding potentially into smaller wheels, smaller tire markets. I just want to understand your thinking on that, because I would think those markets typically you would think of them as being more competitive, resulting in lower margins, which I'm sure is not the goal here. So if you could expand on those comments as well?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes. Maurice's comment highlights that military sales used to play a significant role in Titan's revenue, but we've lost that segment over the last 15 years. Now, we see a chance to regain those military sales, which would be beneficial for our current shareholders. We're merging past experiences with our present innovations, like the new products we discussed on the call, and our enhanced manufacturing capabilities that allow us to serve a range of sizes and markets, including tires and wheels worldwide. We're approaching the military market differently now, aiming to seize these opportunities again. This isn't viewed negatively as a risk for shareholders; rather, it's an upside potential. Maurice's enthusiasm in the press release reflects this sentiment, as we believe we can recapture sales that were lost years ago. Regarding the smaller tires and wheels, 2024 has been a valuable learning year as we integrate Titan and Carlstar. Titan traditionally excelled in larger products, whereas Carlstar focused on smaller ones. Merging the two gives us a strong, diverse product portfolio across both aftermarket and OEM sectors. Notably, in the markets we're discussing, we perceive either similar or less competition. By uniting a strong brand with solid distribution, we create an appealing platform. While there may seem to be heightened competition, many purchases are ultimately driven by brand trust and distribution strength. Our approach ensures we can meet customer needs effectively, contributing to the perception of reduced competition in these smaller tire and wheel segments.

Steve Ferazani, Analyst

So you're talking about that like with Carlstar, this very specific niche markets, not the very broad consumer market?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

You got it. Yes, we're expanding into specific areas along those pathways, but you're correct that we're not suddenly considering every small tire and wheel out there. And when I mention small, it's relative. For example, a Carlstar trailer tire and some of these turf tires are still quite large, just smaller compared to a 1250 LSW.

Operator, Operator

Thank you. Our next question comes from Brian of Baird. Brian, your line is now open.

Unidentified Analyst, Analyst

Good morning, gentlemen. A couple of questions for you. Dave, I think you mentioned, or maybe we'll shoot Paul that volumes were down much lower-than-expected. So two parts on that. What was the operating rate impact on margins? And how has the increase in rubber and butadiene costs also hurt you in the last couple of quarters?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes. Great question. If you look at where our margins were a year ago, that's pretty much the change. That's really the volume that's really killing us. You are seeing some pressure on the cost like you just suggested, and perhaps a little bit of pressure not enabling us to pass it on to customers at this point. So there's a little bit of, call it, price or cost increases that impacted our operating leverage, but it's mostly volume.

Unidentified Analyst, Analyst

Got it. Could you provide it ever sort of what the operating rate of the plants are at any point and specifically what they could be today?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

No, we don't usually discuss each plant individually. We focus on our segments and the distinctions between Ag and EMC, with Ag being global and many EMC plants located in Europe. Consequently, there is different operating leverage at these plants, affected by material costs and steel volatility. If you look back at 2022 and 2023, the average margins we observed at a mid-cycle peak are what we aim to achieve. Currently, we are operating well below those levels, which is the pressure we are experiencing now. However, as we work towards recovery, there is no reason we can't regain that operating leverage.

Unidentified Analyst, Analyst

Understood. Regarding the balance sheet, you mentioned the reduction in trade working capital during the quarter. How much more potential is there to optimize trade working capital from the balance sheet?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes, inventory is crucial. We maintain strong control over our accounts receivable and manage our supplier payments carefully. While there are opportunities with inventory levels, we monitor them closely. Currently, as a percentage of sales, inventory is higher than desired, but this is aligned with our projections for production and demand over the next 90 to 120 days. We are diligently aiming for optimal inventory levels at all times. I’m never completely satisfied, but overall, we have managed it effectively. Looking ahead to 2025, where we anticipate increased profitability, we will continue to focus on optimizing our working capital, as this will positively impact our cash flow. It all contributes to maintaining a robust balance sheet.

Unidentified Analyst, Analyst

Understood. And just switching maybe to the cash balances. Obviously, you drew just a portion of cash to repurchase the shares post-quarter end, and you drew on the revolver the rest. Good to assume that, most of that cash is overseas? Sorry, I didn't dig into the Q that closely today.

David Martin, Senior Vice President and CFO

Yes. Traditionally, we've carried the majority of our cash offshore. We have some, call it, limited opportunities to bring cash, move cash around without any tax impact, and we'll continue to do that. We did that earlier in 2024 and we'll continue to do that and replace cash that we use for the transaction, or pay down debt as well. So we're looking at those opportunities right now and expect to see some things happen over the next 60 days.

Unidentified Analyst, Analyst

Got it. And the last question for me, it has been mentioned a while, but from time-to-time over the last bunch of years, there's been discussion about potential sale of the Titan tractor business. Is that something that you guys still consider as a possibility these days or is that more a core business within Titan International going forward?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

From a management perspective, we view it as a core business. I mean, it's a business that we've invested well into. So they've had a good growth and margin profile in recent years. It performs at a very good level, does a great job with a strong brand and taking care of our customers, which fits the Titan profile of the core business. But as you mentioned in the past, we've been approached with discussions pertaining to divesting ITM. And I would just say, on behalf of the Board, if approached, we always, not always, but in the case of ITM, we feel like that's the right thing for our shareholders to engage in those discussions. And then, if they reach a point where we have to talk about them publicly, then we do. I would say, our position really hasn't changed. If approached, I think our Board would engage in those discussions. But how David and I see it from a management standpoint, along with the management team at ITM which is Sheila and Oscar, is that it's a core business and we treat it as such. In fact, Dave and I will be there next week talking about 2025 strategic plans with them.

Operator, Operator

Our next question comes from Brian Lantier of Zacks Research. Brian, your line is now open.

Brian Lantier, Analyst

Good morning. It's Brian Lantier submitting for Tom this morning. I think you've touched on a couple of these already, but I just wanted to ask for a little bit more color. If you have any feedback from recent trade shows in the Ag market specifically, do you feel like there's a tipping point in interest rates potentially, where it could jump-start the market? And, is there any talk or was there any talk at these trade shows about potential for demand pull forward related to the prospect of new tariffs being implemented after the elections?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes. I mean, I think interest rates in a lot of industries, folks are waiting for them to come down and drive activity in a meaningful way. In our business, what we hear is, I mean, interest rates are impacting their purchasing decisions and then also the amount of inventory they want to keep in the channel. I would say, at this point, I mean, the trade show discussions haven't been meaningfully different from January through currently and pertaining to the market. I think what I would highlight though and what we're seeing in our particular business, when you talk about wheels and tires is that impact of destocking. What we believe has taken place with this destocking again partly due to interest rates, partly due to the post-pandemic effect wearing off is that, in our business, we think the destocking has over had a larger burden on us relative to the market. And so as the OEMs get their production and their inventory back in line, we see 2025 having some positive uplift in our sector, because you're going to get back to just inventory purchases, our sales being in line more with what's going on in the marketplace. We've been overly impacted this year by the inventory destocking. And so, I think that is an effect that is positive for us in 2025, regardless of where the market goes. I mean, I would say this in relation to the market, the catalysts are out there and it's going to happen and in times when things are this bad, we have a tendency to extrapolate too far that it pierces through the trough, it just keeps going. I do feel like we're at the bottom of the trough. I do think there's going to be a catalyst out there. I think the election being done, whatever direction it goes, will provide at least certainty and clarity towards future paths. And so, I do think we are at a point where you can start seeing things break through at some point in 2025. But again, I think for us the key thing is, we do think the destocking, subsiding in 2025 will have a positive impact and catalyst for us in 2025.

Brian Lantier, Analyst

Great. Great. And the military option?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

The trade shows have been an enjoyable experience for our team as we discuss our innovations. At the Titan Booth during the Farm Progress Show, the atmosphere and energy this year have been just as strong as in previous years. We are genuinely excited about our direction and what we are achieving, and I believe there are many witnesses who could attest to that. During challenging times, our innovations tend to become more noticeable, as customers are not merely looking to replace their existing products but seeking ways to improve. We have innovations that can certainly meet that need. This is the perfect moment to highlight the fuel efficiency and cost savings we can provide, enhance equipment performance, and assist with soil compaction. Our new VPO technology allows you to do your job on a golf course without the concern of going flat, which is impressive. The enthusiasm for our innovations seems to increase even during downturns. I think I've shared enough for now.

Brian Lantier, Analyst

That's great. To follow up on that, when you engage with the military and enter the military market, is the sales approach similar? Are they mainly focused on increased efficiencies, or is it more about performance that initiates those discussions?

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes. It's both, but it is different. I think that's why I keep highlighting military as a great opportunity because we've done all this innovation. We brought it into our core segments. And like I said earlier, we've lost this military sales, but yet we have this great technology and I think we can combine the two. So we do need to have the right contacts in order to do that. And I think where you're seeing more excitement come through, as we him and I and now get our team involved, we're seeing these contacts start to open up and then we get in there and we start talking about our technology and what we can do different than the competition. But to be honest with you, just being candid with you, it's just a part of our business that has really for a number of different reasons, changes within the military, and then obviously changes here within Titan where we lost some of our key sales people in military through the years, just weren't able to replace them with the same experience, the same knowledge. We tried to put some folks in there. In military, you do need those that deep experience and knowledge. And so for me, that's where I think our team being able to bring Morrie into the fold and use his experience and knowledge is what we are doing. That's what he's excited about because he's like, holy cow, this used to be a really nice part of Titan, let's go get it back. But again, the sales were lost 15 years ago. It's not like we're talking about it because these were lost two years ago. This is something that, again, a change that took place a while ago, but now we see some avenues where we can go get it back. And again, it would be all accretive to future earnings.

Brian Lantier, Analyst

Great. And just a housekeeping one for the model. Do you guys provide any guidance on where you think share count maybe at the end of the year?

David Martin, Senior Vice President and CFO

I can certainly give that to you. I don't want to quote-off the top of my head on that, but it's in the $63 million range because of the recent repurchase.

Operator, Operator

Thank you. We currently have no further questions. So I'd like to hand back to Mr. Reitz for any closing remarks.

Paul Reitz, President and CEO

Yes. Thank you everybody for joining the call today. I do want to conclude by talking about a few things we have going on the Investor Relations front. Certainly, we enjoy the opportunity to get out there and meet with all of you. We have some conferences we'll be attending over the next couple of months. We'll be at the Baird Conference, their industrial event on November 13th, Three Part Advisors, Southwest Conference on November 20; the BofA Leveraged Finance Conference on December 3rd; Noble Capital has an event that we'll be attending on November 4th, and then we got a couple of virtual events that are going to be really good ones. Oppenheimer on December 12th and Northland on December 12th as well. Again, just want to highlight some opportunities for us to get out there and interact with all of you and look forward to doing that and appreciate your attendance on today's call. Thank you.

Operator, Operator

Thank you. As we conclude today's call, we thank everyone for joining. You may now disconnect your lines.