Earnings Call Transcript - XNSE:GLASSWALL 2026-11-04

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Glasswall Systems India Limited due to FY27 running's conference call hosted by Motilal Oswal Financial Services. As a reminder, all Paisen lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance for the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mrs. Sanjeev Singh from Mutila Local Financial Services. Thank you and over to Mrs. Singh.

Sanjeev Singh, Head of Investor Relations

Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining this call. We have with us today Mr. Eshaan Hemrajani, Managing Director and CEO, Mr. Amit Hemrajani, Director, and Mr. Zendaya Savan, Chief Financial Officer of the company. With this, I hand over the call now to the management for their opening remarks. Over to you, sir.

Speaker 6

Thank you, Sanjeevji. Hi, good afternoon, everyone. It is a pleasure to speak to you all again. This is Isha Nindidani here and the MD and CEO of the company. This is our second call for listing for quarter two, and I would like to brief and update all the investors as to what has happened in the previous quarter and what we see is going to happen ahead with the business. I would start off by saying that from an industry perspective, we are, just to recollect quickly, we are operating in the domestic business, where we are working pan-India for grade-A developers of the country. We also have an export business that we do in terms of the product supply to U.S., Australia, and other countries. And we also have a luxury registration arm where we service high-end residential projects. All of this is for the Prasad Solutions, which is the primary business that the company does. So, maybe I can give you all a quick update of what we see is happening in the domestic and other markets from a demand perspective. For the domestic market, what we see today in all the tier 1 cities of the country is tremendous demand in terms of the new projects that are getting built on the commercial side as well as the hospitality side as well as the residential side. So, in terms of what projects are getting launched, I see that there is a huge fraction today in the domestic market. So, our pipeline in terms of orders that we are bidding on the domestic side remains huge and handy. So, we see huge traction from the domestic segment as the market continues to grow. On the export segment, again, the demand remains strong. There are some challenges right now considering the ongoing war, disruption to shipping. Disruption in prices of commodities. So, especially the elections, the mid-term elections in the U.S. So, we see that there is certain, I would not say a complete slowdown, but there is definitely some prudence around the international business where developers in the U.S. and other countries are holding till there is some clarity or maybe a little bit of normalization of prices around the container cost and also commodities, right? So, it is obviously... So, while that market is huge and remains tremendously huge for us, right now we are seeing that a lot of jobs that are basically on the table to be launched are right now getting held back to a certain extent in order for some sort of clarity to come across the war and the commodity crisis. As a long-term view on this market, I think there is no doubt that this will remain one of our biggest traction factors and one of our major diversification factors. But I was in the US and Canada and Israel, so I found that at least in US right now, people are a little bit cautious about launching new jobs. That is not reflection of our performance. That is not reflection of our thought competitiveness. That is just... How the market currently is with all the uncertainty around shipping and the other costs, right? We are also exploring a relationship into Israel, and that we find is very attractive. We had a very good trip into that country. We are discussing with the company for potential jobs, and we see that maybe in quarter three and quarter four, we should have some sort of a order. Booking into Israel as a start of entry into that market. So that market looks very promising as a first-hand view for us, and we expect that we should be able to convert some jobs in the next two quarters. Even in the U.S., we are continuously bidding on jobs. I think there should be a couple of jobs that should get awarded to us in quarter three and quarter four. So, while there are some challenges specifically on the U.S. side, I find that for next year, we should be sorted from a new order standpoint, even from U.S. and maybe to start with in Israel also. The third business is obviously the luxury penetration side, which is high-end residences and high-end residential projects. I think this... Particular segment is looking very promising. We have decent orders today on this segment, and we are bidding on luxury projects in Delhi and in Mumbai, and you know there is a huge market and traction around the premium penetration products. So, we again expect, maybe in Q3 and Q4, a decent amount of order booking, substantial order booking in this particular segment. So, as a whole, in terms of the pipeline and how we see the market, the domestic market, both on the commercial and residential side, as well as the luxury fenestration side, seems extremely promising. And on the expose type also seems promising, but I think it is, there are certain headwinds right now that we are experiencing. Our order book as of September end stands at around 9.57th roll. We have... We have booked around 291 crores of orders since the beginning of this financial year, and our expectation around order booking would be close to 500 crores and maybe more in the next two quarters. So that will give us at the end of the year a good 18-month visibility in terms of the orders that we will have in hand at the end of this financial year. So, there is greater confidence around at least new jobs coming in at the margin profile that we have been achieving historically. At the same margin profile, we are confident that we will be able to book jobs in the next two quarters, right, to maintain the 18-month visibility that our business requires. In terms of how the S1 results have come through, I think it is fairly encouraging. Our S1 year-on-year from last year saw revenue growth of around 16% at 239 crores. Our EBITDA percent, EBITDA margin percent has increased to 25.3% and in absolute terms has increased by around 22%.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Our pack margin has remained in the same

Speaker 6

sort of a region at around 19.6% as on H1 of 27. So, from a margin standpoint and a revenue standpoint, the quality of the business remains the same and good. We have also mentioned in the last... Last earnings call that from this particular year, we have started including freight as an income and as well as a cost for our export clients in order to help them get better deals on transportation. So just by that nature, there is definitely an equivalent amount of revenue as well as income added in the first two quarters. If we adjust for that, Freight, which is just a pass-through for us, the margins look better, obviously, in comparison to along with the freight. So, if you adjust for freight, our EBITDA margins would have been 26.9%, which is a decent growth from last year, X1. So, what I am trying to say in summary is that the margin profile of the business remains strong. Revenue has grown 16% from an H126 to H127 basis. And as we discussed on the last call, Q3 and Q4 are going to be much stronger for us because there are a couple of projects that are going on full speed in our factory and on our sites today. So, The guidance around the revenue growth for this year remains the same as it was last time that we expect to grow at between 20 to 22 percent in terms of the revenue while maintaining and sustaining the same margin profile for this year. So I don't think there is any change that I want to suggest that is going to happen for this particular financial year. In terms of the glass processing unit, maybe I can speak about that a little while. That is why we have raised the primary money for the ICO. So, that particular project is progressing very well. We are already in an advanced stage of civil construction. The building material has just started coming into our factory today. So, we assume all the orders for the machine grease have already been placed. The advances have been paid out. So, we are on track in terms of the timeline of delivery of the glass processing unit. And we are confident that the guidance that we have given that maybe July, August of next year, we should be able to commission this plant, right? So, that particular subject is going on track. That will obviously give us more control over our supply chain and we are estimating at least 1-1.5% improvement on our EBITDA margins, right, which will be in effect maybe towards the quarter 3 and quarter 4 of next year. In terms of So, in terms of the Israel visit, I told you all that it was quite positive and we see that we should be able to book something in the next two quarters. Overall, I think the business is looking strong. We are continuing to work hard. We are continuing to do what we've been doing for the past two, three years. So, I see no reason to change any sort of guidance for this year and even for the next year, right? So, I think that's all from my side. I'm going to hand it over to Sanjay Kavan who's our CFO. Maybe he'll speak a little bit about the numbers and then we can open it for a question-answer session.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Thank you, Nishan, and good afternoon to everyone. Let me now take you through the key financial and operations highlights for the H1 FY27. For H1 FY27, revenue from operations 2.239 crore, registering a strong year-on-year growth of 16%. The revenue mix was as follows. Revenue from domestic business 2.140 crore, up 33% year-on-year basis, driven by the strong project execution. Revenue from international business is $2.76,00, down by 14% year-on-year basis due to signing up of order execution, which delivers straight away over the coming quarter. As Dishan said, we encourage everyone to assess this business on annualized basis. Then, revenue from international business is $2.22,00, up to 82% year-on-year, driven by the rising demand for the luxury residential segment. EBITDA for 2021 came at 60 crores, reflecting the growth of 22% year-on-year basis. EBITDA margins rose at 25.3%, expanding by 138 basis points year-on-year basis. For EBITDA, if we adjust the freight cost, which we said that the freight is added in the income as well as the expenses, so if we adjust for the freight cost of revenue from both revenue and the other expenses, EBITDA margin will have been 26.9%. For Expo, Expo 21, profit tax returns to 46 crores, representing the growth of 13%. So, past margin remain at the 19.2%. So, as on September 26, our total order book stands at 19.57 crores, and we expect this order to be delivered over the next 18 to 24 months. This is all from our end, and now we can open the floor for the Q&A section.

Operator

Thank you very much, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin with the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask questions, may please press star and one on the touch phone phone. If you wish to withdraw yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Five cents are requested to use only handouts while asking a question. We'll wait for a moment while the questions are assembled.

Operator

You may please press star and one to ask questions.

Operator

The first question is from the line of Harj Khothari from NK Securities. Please go ahead.

Speaker 6

Hello, so am I audible? Yes, you are a little hard. Yeah. So, yeah, thanks for the opportunity. So, yeah, as you mentioned that there is some less clarity in the international fashar business due to the war and the election thing. So, what I wanted to know that, like, in the last call, you mentioned that our Q3, Q4 is going to be substantially well because of the order execution which is going to happen in our international fashar business.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

And as far as I know, it's mostly related to the U.S. business. So, I wanted to know that are the customers denying for the orders which we already

Speaker 6

have, or is it related to the new orders which we are getting? No, it is not related to the existing orders. The existing orders are on the floor and getting dispatched on a daily basis. So, there is no question of any stopping on the existing orders. What basically happens in the U.S. is the job has to be funded 100% before they start the job building it out already. So, all these jobs which are already on the floor are funded. So, they are going and going to happen as planned. And hence, we are saying that Q3 and Q4 is going to be very strong. What is happening on the newer jobs is that even though the funding is done, the developers there are holding for a certain time until the prices normalize a little bit. This happened during COVID also where there was A lot of jobs that were there at the last, let's say, 95%, but they wouldn't start the job. And post-COVID, we saw a huge influx of jobs because everything came at one time. So, I see a repeat of what has happened during COVID happening now, where there is huge demand of residential and commercial projects in the US. Developers have everything lined out, but are holding for maybe some time if the prices normalize. And what you could probably see is after this midterm elections and maybe if the war stops, that there will be huge kind of demand coming all at once, because all the jobs will go at once. So, it is not a question of the existing disease. It is a question of what we see upcoming in the next year or two.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Okay, so you mean your Q3, Q4 is going to be good, as you said in the last call, related to the, yeah.

Speaker 6

Okay, and about your Q3, Q4, yeah.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Okay, yeah, and like the domestic business of the fenestration, it's looking good. Like, I mean, we see a good growth in the first year compared to the last half quarter. So, we are seeing a good growth in the fenestration business. Are we expecting the similar growth year on

Speaker 6

year in the, like, coming, upcoming year as well? Yeah, see, this particular segment looks very promising for us, okay? We see that a lot of luxury residential projects are getting launched, and we are in a sweet spot where we are amongst the very few guys in the country who can cater to this demand. So, while I don't look too much into a quarter-to-quarter 82% growth, I wouldn't want you to read into that too much because it is given by project execution. But as an overall segment, I find that this penetration is usually attractive and can show exponential growth. I mean, maybe I can tell you we are betting on a couple of projects right now, as you speak, and I said that we could have order booking in maybe the next, this quarter and the next quarter, and you would see that they are massive projects by size, you know, so, and obviously at a better margin just by the nature of that segment that we are in. So I see that as a huge growth driver for us, maybe in the next year and continuing ahead. Okay, and just my last question, the thing you said is the 500 CR is the total order book for the entire yearbooking or just Q3, Q4? It's Q3, Q4. So, today we have around 950-950 crores of which we will execute a decent amount, you know, 300 plus crores in the next two quarters. A little bit more than that only, 350 crores in the next two quarters. So, we have to book that and plus. So, my guidance is around creating an order book at the end of the year, so for the next 18 months. And I think we are very confident that we will achieve that.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

All right, so that's your comfort. Thank you so much.

Speaker 6

Yeah.

Operator

Thank you.

Speaker 6

Thank you.

Operator

The next question. Thank you, sir. We'll take the next question from the line of Tritesh Sheda from Lucky Investments. Please go ahead.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

There's two questions I have. One around the order book. Since your company recently listed, so maybe you want to give us a trending order book in terms of. What you started at the beginning of the year this year, and what will you end this year in terms of your calculations in terms of order book, and what was it last year when you started the year at?

Speaker 6

Okay. So, Sanjayji, you need to help me with the beginning order book of this year. Because I can, I can take it from there.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Okay, the beginning order book was the 383 crore.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Last year, April 26th, in the 1st April 2025, we have a order of the 383 crore.

Speaker 6

One second, one second, one second. Sanjay ji, April 26th, company level ka order book kya tha? 846 crore. Yeah. 846 crore. Okay. Right. 846 crores was our opening order book as of April 26th.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

What says 383 crores last year as Sanjeev Uchak said, right?

Speaker 6

FY25 was 383. FY25 was 383. FY26, April 26th was 848 crores. As of today, it is 9.57. And what I see as the closing order book, as a projected, give me a second.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

And my second question around that is, whatever comments you mention on the market, etc., with respect to the order you have, yes, yes, sir.

Speaker 6

It should be upwards of 1000 crores.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Okay. So basically, so basically the, so if you have an upward of 1000 crore and 940 crore type of order book today in hand, and 6 months of execution, then your second half has to be a materially large revenue number, right?

Speaker 6

Yes.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Okay, my other question is, with whatever comments that you made about slightly future ahead, which is also a comment which changes with time, but with respect to the order that you have today on the shop floor, and the order that you have to deliver to your client because the site is on. Do you see execution there, smooth or better talent, there is a slowdown in execution there? Because considering your revenue projection there, doesn't seem to be slowdown, but yet I am asking a clarification.

Speaker 6

See, at the end of the day, we are a product business, right? So right now, we, right now what I see is, as I told you, whatever orders we have on the export side are flying. Right? There's no stopping that. On the domestic side, there are one or two projects that are going a little behind schedule, not from our end, but from the client's end. But it is nothing material in nature that I need to flag up on this call. It is the normal course of business.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Okay. This is good enough. And the material price rises any. Let's say aluminium price, section aluminium price, because that's a bigger component. How does that get factored in execution? So, is it a flow-through or is it an inventory booster that you do before execution? What happens then?

Speaker 6

You are asking in terms of the base price, right? So, I'll explain again. We have a pass-through on aluminum and glass on all projects, right? So, we have to collect all the invoices in terms of what we have procured. The base rate is mentioned in the contract. And then there is a process to be done with the client in terms of doing the math around what needs to be passed on. And once that is done and we raise the invoice in terms of a claim, that gets paid off to us by the client. Right? So, this is how we are doing and we are, in that sense, risk-free from a commodity pricing across the products that we are doing today.

Speaker 8

Thank you. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Yeah, thank you. Thank you, sir.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, in order to ensure that the management will be able to address questions from all the participants in the conference, can you limit your questions to only two participants? Should you have a follow-up question, please rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Priyanka Garwal from Bank of India Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

Hello, I hope I'm audible. Yes, you are.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Hi.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

Yeah. Hi. So, three questions from my side. Firstly, what percentage of our contracts are currently cost plus? And specifically, this quarter, how much of the escalation revenue booked represents a prior period catch-up?

Speaker 6

Okay. So, I'll answer that. None of our drops are cost plus. All our jobs are remeasurable item rate contracts. The only difference is that even though it's an item rate contract, there are protection clauses around the commodity prices, specifically aluminum and glass. So, we get the spec of a job, we quote for that spec, and we quote for that quantity. So, the quantity changes or the spec changes, our price changes. And, and as I told you, there is protection in terms of the base price of aluminum and glass. So, we declare what we have held in the court in terms of the aluminum pricing, and any change that happens, we submit the relevant backup documents, and we get paid. So, typically, that process takes some time. So, like, for example, in this quarter, those planes got certified, right, for Bagmania and a couple of other projects, but the cost was incurred in the previous quarter. So, this is, again, normal course of business that just by the virtue of time taking to establish that claim, which is typically maybe anywhere between 45 to 60 days, we hold the cost in that time and then it gets reimbursed to us.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

Okay, okay.

Speaker 6

Does that answer your question? I am happy to give more clarification if you have any doubts around this.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

No, it does. Thank you. And secondly, on the glass processing unit, so what are the key milestones remaining before it becomes fully operational? What is left?

Speaker 6

So, we are right now on an advanced state of civil construction. As we call it, we have pasted the plinth beam, which is like the base of the civil. The PB structure, which is the building on top, the material has started coming in. So, in terms of how far along are we on the physical construction of the building, I would say fairly far ahead, right? Maybe next two to three months, I think we should be through with our civil and the factory construction. The next milestone is the machinery coming in, the installation of the machinery and commissioning, which we find that maybe starting from now, within the next six months, all the machinery should be available with us in the factory. Then there is a period of installation and commissioning. So, all in all, we are looking at maybe July or August of next year-end for the factory to start in a full-fledged fashion. Till then, it will be these milestones. So civil construction, machinery alignment, and then installation and commissioning. Civil construction may be next 2 to 3 months, machinery alignment next 6 months, 6 to 7 months, and then commissioning and installation may be another 2 to 3 months. So we are looking at around maybe around 11 odd months from now, 10-11 months from now.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

Okay, and one last one, if I may. So, what could be the expected revenue contribution from this Israel pipeline, and also the ongoing U.S. bids that we spoke of, like, are they targeting existing relationships or new client acquisitions?

Speaker 6

We are doing both. We will speak about Israel first. Israel, I was, I think the last call I was there, it was, looks very promising. There is a lot of new construction happening in that country, and they are short of capacity, right? So, they are looking at us as an extension to their capacities, right? So, there are big jobs that they are bidding for. I envisage that they will start with us on a smaller job, maybe Believe below 50% maybe. This is what I see. But once we have sort of the first job through, I think that job sizes in Israel are huge. So, from maybe a two-year look-ahead, one-and-a-half two-year look-ahead, I see that there will be big jobs coming from there. Right now, as any relationship starts, I think they'll start with us maybe with something in the range of 50-odd crores to start with. In the US, again, the jobs are massive. Our clients, current ones and new ones, are bidding on a lot of jobs. It is just like built-up demand which could open up at any time. So when that does, I think it will be huge. Do I see that happening maybe in the next quarter or so? I feel like we should be able to get a couple of jobs over the line.

Priyanka Garwal, Analyst — Bank of India Mutual Fund

Okay. Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shruti Mojan Rani from IJITI Asset Management. Please go ahead.

Shruti Mojan Rani, Analyst — Asset Management

Hi, Utham. Hi, Sanjay. Good morning. So, I have a couple of questions, starting with the escalate schemes. Would it be possible to quantify the absolute amount of the benefit that you got in this quarter because of these schemes?

Operator

Six floors.

Shruti Mojan Rani, Analyst — Asset Management

Six floors, okay. And do we expect them to, you know, come ahead because I think some inflation will get in life in one or two quarters, so do we expect this to happen again?

Speaker 6

Of course, there will be some contribution on a quarterly basis around this, because each and every, whenever the project reaches that milestone, we will put the claim in. The cost would be incurred in the industry.

Shruti Mojan Rani, Analyst — Asset Management

Okay, got it. Secondly, I think you mentioned that you are looking for a 500 close-up order inflow for the next two quarters. Would it be possible to give a clear term which will be coming from domestic exposure and penetration?

Speaker 6

I would not like to comment right now on that, but I can tell you that there will be a decent amount in all three sides, on all three sides. But maybe we can connect later and I can give you sort of a breakup because that will be, because we are bidding on big jobs, right? Today, today my order pipeline that I'm bidding on on domestic is upwards of 3,000 crores. So, the real question is, And I've said this before, it's for us to choose the right job with the right execution timeline and at the right margin. So, today we are in that zone that we have to pick the right job. And if I have a good job in the domestic side, sure, I'll go ahead and book it. If I have a good job on the penetration side, I'll go ahead and book it. So, this is what we need to do in terms of 500. We have a huge pipeline that we are bidding for. What job we want to convert depends on what the deal on the table is. The idea would be to pick up some on either all three segments. This is the aim.

Shruti Mojan Rani, Analyst — Asset Management

And this sounds encouraging. Just last thing from my side, I think you have mentioned this before that Q324 will be a very strong, you know, growth for us. So, just a clarification from my side, given, you know, the kind of revenue we have done in H1 F527, if I extrapolate, I can see maybe we can do upwards of 3% offline growth in H2 F527. So, just a clarification of that.

Speaker 6

That is ballpark accurate, correct.

Shruti Mojan Rani, Analyst — Asset Management

Got it, got it. That's it from my side. Thank you so much. All the way.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Operator

The next question is from the line of Shrikant from Pinpoint X Capital. Please go ahead.

Speaker 8

Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, can you overview of what is the demand for playing in sectors like water consumption and age potential in the build-out? What is the demand? Sorry, sorry.

Speaker 6

Sorry, I missed that question. Can you repeat again, please?

Speaker 8

Yeah, how is the demand input from segments like hotel construction or airport construction data center built out over India and over the globe?

Speaker 6

That's a superb question. See, in this past quarter, we booked a hotel project in Mumbai, right? It's close to a 90 crore job. And we booked a data center job, two data center jobs in south of India, which is around 35-40 crores, right? So, both these segments look encouraging. Data center for us is going to happen, but I wouldn't expect some crazy sort of a demand on data center because just by the nature of that building, facade is something that is only done in a data center because there is no occupant in that building, right? So, the product spec on the data center sort of buildings is very different to what you would see on a commercial building where there are active occupants on the inside of the building. Why certain data center guys do it is to have a better aesthetic on their assets more than the function requirement needed on data centers, right? So while we have done data centers even in the last year and we continue to book data centers, I would imagine that that will continue but not at the rate at which data centers are being built in the country. It will be a few jobs here and there. On the other hand, hospitality seems very promising for us. I think huge development there on the hospitality side and same again on the commercial side as well.

Speaker 8

So, thank you for this, and one more question is that, how is the level of BIPV solar canal adoption as part of

Speaker 6

Yeah, BIPV is a big thing. It's a thing of the futures where we are going to put solar panels on the face of the building. So, we are already in our R&D team right now is working on BIPV technologies where we can use our machinery for glass and incorporate maybe a machinery, additional machinery for BIPV and start building. Thank you very much, everyone, and welcome to the Q&A, and welcome to the Q&A, and welcome to the Q&A, and welcome to the Q&A, We are exploring this angle right now.

Speaker 8

So, and final question is that our company is very strong in facade system and fenestration. So, whether we have capabilities to provide architecture service to the same builder if they come to us to provide us, whether they are a little architecture service, whether we can provide similar service to them in addition to the facade and fenestration?

Speaker 6

No, I don't think we can do that. We are not architects by profession. We can give them consultation around the facade elements. Uh, with regards to their architectural intent. So, we do a program called as a design assist program, where we stick from the building architect and suggest them solutions around the fenestration solutions. But as a whole trade of doing an entire architecture of a building, I don't think that is, that is our key area of business, and I don't think we are venturing into that sort of a journey.

Speaker 8

Sure, on one final clarification.

Operator

I'm sorry to interrupt you, sir. Sir, I will request to kindly rejoin the queue for follow-up questions. There are others who are waiting for their job. Should I do? Thank you. Request to all the participants to kindly limit your questions to only one for participants. Should you have a follow-up question, please rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Sahil Garg from CCB Fund. Please go ahead.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Hi, sir. Good afternoon. So, my question is on the margin specifically for Q2. If I compare the revenue from Q2 last year, what is Q2 this year? So, it is almost flat, but margins have increased tremendously, like EBITDA margins and the TAC margins, specifically for Q2 this year. So, what is the reason for the increased margin, and are these margins sustainable?

Speaker 6

No, so again, I would encourage this entire investor community that we have today on board to look at the business, first of all, from a yearly business, yearly standpoint, right? While we can look and delve into the quarterly numbers and I can provide you answers, at the end of the day, I think because this is a project business, it is milestone taken. So, when you ask a specific question as to the revenue was flat, but the margin is increased, there are two things that are contributed here, right? One was the escalation claim that has gone through in this previous quarter, right? For which cost was incurred earlier. So, there has been impact in terms of the margin percentage due to the revenue being recognized in this quarter, but the cost being recognized in the previous quarter, right? There is also elements around the product mix, right? Penetration, you see, is grown at a decent amount on a year-on-year basis, on a quarter-on-quarter yearly basis, thankfully, which is a higher margin business for us. So, on account of that, revenue being done greater, there is a greater contribution to the bottom line also. So, between the two things, you see that there is a spike in the margins in quarter two.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankur Kumar from Alpha Capital. Please go ahead.

Speaker 6

Hi, I'm good.

Speaker 8

Hi. Hello, sir. Thank you for taking my question. Sir, in terms of answer.

Speaker 6

One second. Annie, Annie, we'll take, we'll take as many questions as possible here. Let them, let it go. If you're not in Iraq, I'm not in Iraq. I'm happy to answer everyone. Yeah. Okay, sir, I'm going to read, Ankur. Yeah, please, go on.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Yeah, sir, actually, in the last TV interview, I was listening, and you got it for 590 crore of revenue for this year.

Speaker 6

Am I right on that number? I don't know, I don't think I have spent out a number in that clarity, but I have always promised that the growth in terms of what we have done historically is at around 24% in the past year, and we would be in that ballpark.

Speaker 8

Got it. And so, second half, would you like to give some closer, better number in terms of growth, etc., of what all we should be looking at?

Speaker 6

I would like for it to be a positive surprise, but I can tell you that 2324 is going to be strong. There were previous questions around what percentage of growth, and I think people have done the math that it should be. We are obviously looking at definitely 22% growth as of last year. So I think it's an easier math for anyone to do because we have last year numbers.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

Got it. And, sir, on this margin volatility, is it like export mixes much higher this quarter and that is why margins are higher and how should we look at that?

Speaker 6

Not necessarily. Yes, there is a contribution toward certain segments being at a slightly greater margin than the other. So, as a result of what to institute it, definitely the margin could go up and down. Then, as I told you, there are certain claims that go through at certain times. This could represent the spike in margin, but at the end of the day, if you see at a consolidated level, this business is fairly stable, because we know at the end of the day what we are going to deliver, with certain spikes and certain values also, you know, so that's how I look at this, look at our business. And for you, is that not margin? Yeah, yeah, please go on. A full year, we expect like last year margin or like 25% type margin for this year? No, no, like last year, 23 to 25% I did that.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Got it. Got it. Thank you sir. Thank you.

Speaker 6

See our working capital is strong. We still have cash in the bank. I was seeing my working capital days has now become negative, 19 days. Negative 19 days. So the quality of the business remains strong. It is only a question of executing the job which we are doing. And that depends on what the project schedule is.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

And you expected 500 crore order win also in 2-8.

Speaker 6

Yeah, I'm quite highly confident about that, yes. Sure, sir. Thank you all the way. Thank you.

Operator

The next question is from the line of Ankit Babal from Shubka Mentors. Please go ahead.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Hi, Ankit. How are you? Yeah. Great, sir. Hi, Ishan. Just a couple of things. What is your current capacity utilization, and what kind of peak revenue can you do from the current capacities?

Speaker 6

I need to sustain a growth of 22% year-on-year. I think for the next four years, we are spotted, right? Today, my capacity utilization is around 50 by 60%. So, I think revenue, we are looking at 1,000 plus crores of revenue happening from the same facility without material CAPEX to be done.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay, then what would be your CAPEX plan, including the maintenance CAPEX for, say, this year, next year?

Speaker 6

So, obviously, the major CAPEX is the gas processing for which we have a project cost of around 70-odd crores, for which we have raised money. So, those monies are kept separate because they are going to be deployed there, right? Apart from that, our CAPEX plan is, as we are doing it, we have bought out a couple of machineries. I wouldn't imagine it to be about 20 crores in the next year and a half, two years.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay.

Speaker 6

And that would be funded through internal accruals. I don't see anything at all.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay, and this 20-25% revenue growth which you are targeting, I assume it is excluding the freight cost which you are booking it as a revenue. Of course.

Speaker 6

Freight cost excluding. Freight is just a path to, right? Tomorrow the container cost drops down to $4,000 and I get bunch of new jobs. But that will also show a decline in revenue. So whatever I am talking is heck of freight.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Yeah, all the revenue growth and the margins, everything is all

Speaker 6

net of trade. Trade, so we are doing it to help our clients out. Tomorrow they want to go back to our next work, so I'd be more than happy to go back to our next work.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay. And typically, what ticket size of orders you are looking at currently and how is the market? I mean, is there a market for a 100, 200 crore kind of order ticket size or they are in that 25, 50 crore range? What is the range?

Speaker 6

Oh, no, no, no, no. Now, the standard, maybe five years back, the job range was maybe 50, 60 crores, 100 plus crore job was considered to be a big job. Today, I see that that 100 crore has become a normal, 80 to 100 crore job has become a normal sort of a job, right? So, we are seeing average order sizes upwards of 60, 70 crores today. So, and there are jobs that we are bidding for 400 crores also, 500 crores also, single job. So, the job sizes have increased, the scale of development in the country has increased, so the job sizes are becoming larger.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay, and other than the US part which you mentioned that there was a slowdown which you are looking at for a short period of time, but any other risks which you foresee for your business in the near term?

Speaker 6

See, I would put it this way. The reason why we operate in three business verticals is to de-risk ourselves from such kind of scenarios, right? So, today, maybe U.S. is looking a bit slow because they are waiting on things, but on the other hand, my domestic at a good margin is looking extremely solid. So, the question of us struggling on account of U.S. maybe having a temporary slowdown is no big deal, because our capacities across design and manufacturing are fungible. So, I'd be more than happy to pick up the jobs in the domestic side of things and wait for the right time to pick up the export jobs. I'm not saying that we are not going to pick up jobs. As I said earlier, we are expecting that some jobs should come through in quarter three and quarter four, But that doesn't mean that we will have residual capacity left in my factory on account of one business vertical not going very strongly, right? So there is no issue around those things.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay, lastly, you know, the margins in your international profits are relatively higher as compared to the domestic one. So, going forward in the coming years, are you expecting the export contribution to go up in your product mix, and also the fenestration, which also has a higher margin, so the contribution of that segment also going up in the total revenue, or you believe the… Oh, I understand.

Speaker 6

We did. Sorry, this is a three-year view. I see export and penetration being solid road drivers for us.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Okay, so there is some margin question.

Speaker 6

And obviously, and obviously the export is a product business which is fairly scalable and the penetration is a high margin for our business. So I see that both these verticals should be strong growth drivers for us. Having said that, even today the domestic product that we are doing is not at bad margins by any means, you know. We are getting decent amount of value I did in on the domestic segment. And certain growth that we are building now are at excellent margins, you know. Some maybe at par with export or maybe slightly better than the export margin also. So I wouldn't discount the huge domestic growth story that we are having today. Because there are not enough good players in the market, I think the margin that we can enjoy is fairly decent, even on the domestic side, even on the commercial domestic side.

Ankit Babal, Analyst — Shubka Mentors

Oh, okay. That's it. Thank you, all of us. Thank you so much, Ankit.

Operator

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rahul Maheshwari from Ambit Investment Advisors. Please go ahead.

Rahul Maheshwari, Analyst — Ambit Investment Advisors

Hello, good. Hi, Rishan. Thanks for the opportunity and good set of results. Just two couple of things. First, as you mentioned that the pipeline is there for 3,000 crore and now you're cherry-picking the orders. Can you explain in more detail that what kind of orders are you cherry-picking in terms of margins, in terms of and how big the size is increasing and this year, are you Can this funnel size be increasing to what level in the coming 2-3 years?

Speaker 6

So while I don't want to name the project, like by name, because that would be enough time to do that, but... But I can tell you, like, there's a job in Mumbai that is a 400 crore bid. There's a job in Amrawati, which today, to be honest, has a standalone job is a 4000 crore bid from our side. But obviously, it will be split between a couple of guys, so we don't expect that to go to 1%. So the size is, there's a job in Mumbai right now on the fenestration side that is a 85 crore plus job. There's a job of fenestration in Delhi that is a 450 crore court. So, then there are jobs in the range of 100 and 150 crores that are several in nature, several, many. I was just attending a client call before this call, and it is for a leading developer in the country in Rydurg, and our bid is a 225 crore bid, and the guy has called me straight up and said that, you know, this is the price, and if you can match it, I am happy to give the entire thing to you. So, when I say I am going to cherry pick, it is a bunch of things, right? It has to be the right client, it has to be the right terms, it has to be the right margin profile, it has to be the right execution period. I don't want to build up an order book. We should not build up an order book which is not executable, right? Give or take a couple of months here and there, those orders should be good to go. Otherwise, you have an order book which does not go. So, when we cherry pick, we see all these things, and then we go for the right job. And even if then we have to, you know, sort of make a deal, we make a deal.

Rahul Maheshwari, Analyst — Ambit Investment Advisors

Right, right. But what can be the win ratio, suppose if a pipeline of 3,000 crore is in there, what we should assume that going forward on a possible future, not just for FY27 or 28, what kind of win ratio the company can have when the pipeline is in there? I don't look.

Speaker 6

I don't look at it as from a win ratio standpoint. The pipeline is obviously huge. If I were to drop my prices by 5%, I would get all of the 3,000 orders tomorrow itself. So the question is not how much I'm converting in terms of a percentage. What the fact is, is what we discussed earlier in the call. If I need to maintain 18 to 24 months of visibility, which is typically the timeline of the project execution. And I know what I'm going to execute in this year. I know how many orders I need to win at a minimum. And my focus is only to first get that 18 to 24 months of visibility. There is no point for the company today to build up five years of visibility because then we'll be doing injustice to the project schedule. So, as opposed to talking about the wind ratio percentage, which I have and I can give you, but we don't look at that too much. We look at, okay, we need to book at least 500 crores of jobs in the next two quarters so that when we are sitting in FY27, April 27, I know I have visibility for the next 18 to 24 months.

Rahul Maheshwari, Analyst — Ambit Investment Advisors

Right. And as you mentioned, your working capital has become negative. Should we say, is it fair to assume that going forward basis, across cycles, it can be on a negative. I won't hold the every quarter, it should be negative, but as a directional.

Speaker 6

I wouldn't promise, I wouldn't promise that. Last year, we had 44 days working capital. Today, we are on minus. See, I would like you to assume that the working capital days is going to be around 45 days. Got it. Anything below that, anything better than that is a bonus.

Rahul Maheshwari, Analyst — Ambit Investment Advisors

Right. And this last question from mind, as your client has, or customers have asked for that straight course to be born and then recover back from the customer, does this involve a bit of working capital? Though you recover back from the customer, but it happens in a lag manner. So, is it a little bit working capital related that causes to the company? Or it is very minuscule and negligible for you guys?

Speaker 6

This is like unique.

Operator

Sorry sir, your voice broke. Can you repeat that line, please?

Speaker 6

Anjali, can you hear me? Yeah, so we are getting advance. Yeah, please. Go on.

Sanjay Sarant, CFO

We are getting advance against the freight cost, so there is only working capital blockage on account of freight cost.

Rahul Maheshwari, Analyst — Ambit Investment Advisors

Got it. Got it. Thank you so much sir, and best wishes to the entirety.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Yeah, thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Thank you and over to you, sir.

Speaker 6

No, thank you so much, Rani. I think I would like to thank everyone, whoever has come on this call. I really appreciate the business remains strong, the principles remain strong, the next task will be promising, and I would encourage such conversations obviously in the future, and I'm happy to answer all sorts of questions and queries around our business. Thank you so much once again for being on the call. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you, sir. Thank you, members of the management. On behalf of Motila Losual Financial Services, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your line. Thank you.

Tritesh Sheda, Analyst — Lucky Investments

Thank you.