Afcons Infrastructure Limited (AFCONS) Q1 2027 Earnings Call Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the AFCONS Infrastructure Q1-FI27 Earnings Conference Call hosted by DAM Capital Advices Ltd. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star, then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Kishan Munra from Dam Capital Advices Limited. Thank you and over to you, sir.

Thank you, Neshia. Good morning, everyone, and a warm welcome to the Q1FI 27 Earnings Call of AFCON's infrastructure. So, to discuss the results, today we have the management with us, which is represented by Mr. Subramanyam Krishnamurthy, the Executive Chairman, Mr. Srinivasan Parmasivan, the Managing Director, Mr. Ramesh Kumar Jhaad, the CFO, Mr. Hitesh Singh, the Head of Corporate Strategy. Now, at this point, I'll hand over the floor to the management for the initial remarks and post which we can open the floor for the question and answer session. With that, over to you, sir.

Thank you, Kishan. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and Krishnamurti Sudrumanyam. It's a pleasure to connect with our investors, analysts, stakeholders as we begin the new financial year. Thank you for joining us today and for your continued support and interest in Afon's Infrastructure Limited. Our financial results and investor presentation for the quarter have been uploaded on the stock exchanges, and I trust you have had the opportunity to do this. Joining me today are Rameshwanshin University Managing Director, Rameshwamar Joshi, CFO, and Mr. Hitev Singh, Head of Corporate Strategy. Let me begin with an overview of our financial performance for the quarter. Afghans reported a total income of 2,727 crores in QI-FI 27, compared to 3,419 crores in QI-FI 26. EBITDA for the quarter stood at 2,63 crores, with an EBITDA margin of 9.6%. Profit after tax was 30 crores. While our financial performance for this quarter was lower than the corresponding period last year, as several of the challenges we encountered during FI-26 continued into the first quarter of FI-27. In addition, adverse weather conditions affected the progress on certain marine projects, while land handover at a few project sites advanced more slowly than anticipated. Institution of some faster projects also progressed at normal pace due to labor shortages. While a few other projects were impacted by pending clearances. We expect these issues to gradually ease, enabling stronger execution momentum over the coming quarters. During the quarter, we achieved an important milestone. I am delighted to share that the Mumbai-Pune Infrastructure Missing Link project was inaugurated on 1 May 2026, marking yet another defining milestones in Afghanistan's journey of delivering iconic infrastructures for the nation. The cable-state bridge executed by AFCON stands as the centerpiece of this landmark project. Standing as India's tallest road cable-state bridge, it is not merely a bridge, but a reflection of Indian engineering capability, determination, and execution excellence under some of the most challenging conditions. We are proud that the Mumbai-Puna Expressway Missing Link Project is yet another example of many complex and technologically challenging infrastructure projects. As we look ahead, we are equally encouraged by the quality of our existing autobook, which includes several projects that are the potential to become engineering landmarks in their own right. These reinforces our confidence in the long-term strength of our project portfolio and our ability to continue delivering world-class infrastructure. Alongside engineering excellence, our commitment to safety remains unwavering. Safety is a deeply embedded aspect in our culture and continues to be recognized by leading global and domestic institutions. During the quarter, several of our projects agreed British Safety Council's International Safety Awards with distinction. These recognitions are meaningful because they validate the high standards of safety, discipline, and operational excellence that we try to uphold across every Indian project, of course project. Let me now briefly touch upon broader infrastructure environment. For some time now, geopolitical developments have weighed on infrastructure investments and project award activity across several regions. We remain hopeful that as the geopolitical uncertainties across key regions begin to ease, infrastructure investment and project award activity will gradually regain momentum globally as well as in India. Against this backdrop, we continue to pursue opportunities that align with our well-established risk management framework across our core markets in Asia, Africa, Middle East, and neighboring geographies. Our approach remains selective and disciplined with a clear focus on sustainable and profitable growth. As we move through FY27, our priorities remain clear. We will continue Continue to focus on growing order book, improving collections. Strengthening cash flows, and further enhancing and strengthening the balance sheet. These initiatives will provide stronger foundation for our growth and long-term value creation. With that now, I invite our Managing Director, Paramashiv and Siniwazan, to share his remarks on the business outlook and operating performance. Thank you, gentlemen.

Thank you, Mr. Subramanian, and good morning, everyone. I extend a warm welcome. To all our investors, analysts, and participants joining us today, we sincerely appreciate your continued confidence in Afghans and value the engagement you bring to this discussion. As Mr. Subramanian highlighted, the first quarter of 27 continued to be impacted by some of the factors that affected us during the previous financial year, along with certain execution delays. Across a few projects, due to factors beyond our control, liquidity conditions remained tight and collections continued to be moderate during the quarter. We remain actively engaged with our clients at multiple levels to accelerate recoveries and improve cash flows over the coming months. Coming to profitability, we reported an EBITDA margin of 9.6% during the quarter. The moderation in profitability was primarily due to lower revenues during the quarter. As turnover improves across projects, we expect profitability to correspondingly improve over the coming quarters. On the operations front, I am pleased to share that both tunnel boring missions for our Mumbai Ahmedabad high-speed rail C2 package successfully commenced their initial tunneling drives as per schedule. This marks an important milestone for the project, particularly considering the challenges it has encountered over the past year. Having achieved this milestone as planned, we expect the project to move into its next phase of execution with the TPM mind-canneling drives expected to start in the coming months. Coming to order book, I am pleased to share that we have begun financial year 27 on a positive note with a healthy order inflows of Rupees 13,219 crores during the first quarter. With these orders, our order book stood at Rupees 43,219 crores at the end of the quarter, providing strong visibility for future revenues. As on date, our orders booked for the year stands at 15,700 crores, including orders received up to date. With these, there is no order pending to be converted from L1 to that of an order. The healthy order book positions us well for sustained growth over the medium term. As these projects progressively move into the main execution phases, they expect improved operational momentum and a gradual strengthening of our financial performance. It is equally encouraging that these orders, wins, are significant achievements in their own right. The Crozier Railway Project represents the largest single order ever secured by Afkans. While the Vaduan Port Project provides us with the opportunity to construct the world's second largest breakwater, these order wins reflect our strategic intent of focusing on large-value complex jobs without compromising on our risk framework. While this is encouraging, we remain equally focused on securing new orders and further strengthening our order book over the year. Our teams continue to actively pursue opportunities across both domestic and international markets and we remain confident of achieving our full-year order inflow guidance of Rs. 30,000 crores. This is supported by our healthy bid pipeline of approximately 1.5 lakh crores for the remaining 9 months of financial 2017. And 3.96 lakh crores for the next two years across transportation, marine, hydro, underground, water, urban infrastructure, and industrial infrastructure segments. The pipeline is well diversified across segments and geographies and consists of projects that align well with our technical strengths and disciplined risk management framework. To conclude, while some of the challenges that affected financial year 26 have continued into the first quarter of the current year, we remain encouraged by the conversion of key orders and opportunities ahead. We begin this year with a healthy order book, a robust bid pipeline, and a team that has repeatedly demonstrated its ability to deliver complex engineering projects under challenging conditions, as execution across our existing projects gathers pace. Recently secured orders move into their main construction phases. We expect a gradual improvement in performance over the coming quarters. We remain committed to disciplined execution, prudent risk management, and operational excellence while continuing to pursue opportunities that align with our long-term strategies. With our strong technical capabilities, diversified presence, and proven track record, we remain confident in our ability to navigate the current environment and create sustainable long-term value for all our stakeholders. Thank you once again for your continued trust and support. I now hand over the call to our Chief Financial Officer, Mr. Ramesh Jha, to take you through the financial performance in greater detail.

Thank you, sir. Good morning, everyone. Before talking on the numbers, let me reiterate that company is into business of construction. The margin in a quarter varies based on the nature, type, and quantum of work executed. So quarterly results may vary in different quarter and may not be indicative of the annual result or trend. Now, coming specific on the numbers, in this quarter, we have done 2,727 crores of total income, which includes other income of 56 crores. This is 20.3% down from the previous year, wherein we had done 3,419 crores of turnover. This number was also inclusive of the other income. Q1 execution is on the expected lines. As in many projects, there were lack of work front availability. And generally, Q1 remains a little bit slow in terms of collection because of most of our customers being government entities disperse the annual budget by March and then devote Q1 in planning and budgeting for the next financial year. If we talk from the specific experience of financial year 2026-27 Q1, Then we would feel liquidity across market needs significant improvement. Payment related issues in UP GELG1 mission is still continuing. We have received small amount of payment based on the completed portion of work. Also, we have noticed that across the spectrum payments are being stretched for some or the other reason. Hence, we are maintaining the balance between execution and liquidity. In FY27, we have booked order amounting to Rs 15,695 crores till now, taking the pending order book in excess of 45,000 crores. In FY27, we are targeting to significantly improve the order booking and improve the balance sheet by collecting some of the stuck receivables. Uncertainty around the economic activity because of war, geopolitical, and related stuff continues, so it doesn't make sense for any guidance in terms of growth. In terms of EBITDA for the quarter, we have done 263 crores, which is 9.6%. This number has also come down by 41%. We had done 445 crores of absolute number EBITDA, which was 13% in the previous year, quarter 1. In our EBITDA calculation, we consider BG commission as part of our operating expenditure. So EBITDA what we are talking about is after removal of BG commission as an operating expenditure. And this also includes the other income as part of revenue. We have explained earlier also that arbitration interest. Foreign currency exchange came and miscellaneous income are recurring and very integral to our business. Hence, these are factored as other operating income. So, for the Q1 period, around 57 crores is other operating income, which we have factored in EBITDA calculation. In terms of profit before tax, for this period we have done 51 crores of profit. We have done 183 crores of profit before tax in the previous year Q1, and profit after tax is 30 crores, which is also significantly down because we have done 137 crores of profit after tax in the previous year Q1. Profits got impacted because of lower turnover on the Overall basis. Margins in the individual projects continue to be robust but because of lower turnover overall, they could not generate sufficient overall contribution to cover the overhead costs and still have sufficient profit what the company traditionally been doing. We have put lot of efforts towards reducing costs on the possible revenue but that has been partially offset by increase in energy, transport and logistic costs. Talking about the finance cost, in Q1, we have seen higher average borrowing during the quarter. Because of this, interest cost has gone up. Coupled with this, new interest-bearing advances received during last, say, 12 to 15 months has elevated the interest cost on client advances, taking the overall interest cost up. Currently, 62% of our advances are interest-free and 38% of the advances are interest-bearing. This year we have booked substantial order, but the corresponding advances have still not come into the company. A large part of this is from the current orders we have backed is from international market, which is interest-free, and also the orders what we have received in domestic market, the interest rates are quite low. So we expect the interest cost to go down in the coming quarter. In terms of EBITDA, the depreciation is at 83.52 crores, which is 3.06% of the turnover. This quarter, the TBM operations were virtually not there. So, the accelerated depreciation what we charged was not there in the quarter. In terms of tax, The rate is quite high. If we see the PBT vis-a-vis profit after tax, the tax rate is working out almost 40%. This is primarily because on AFCON's profit, what we are paying, the AFCON's standalone profit, what we are paying 25% tax. However, in consolidated profit, this has decreased due to some of the closed projects, which is in JVs and subsidiaries, where minor administrative expenses and provisions leading to small losses. This has got amplified in this quarter because of lower profit in AFCONs. As a result, the tax charge represents a higher percent. Also, few JVs pay tax rate in the range of 35 to 36 percent second in some of the overseas locations like Bangladesh's tax is charged on turnover. In such situation, if you don't make profit above the threshold, your tax deductions needs to be charged off. So, because Afton's profit was lower, some of the other entities, the administrative expenses leading to lower profitability in those entities, the overall tax rate has gone up. In terms of ROC and ROE, we'll talk on the annual number only because it doesn't make sense at this point in time. Specific on the networking capital, the networking capital is at an elevated level because of funding to the projects and no material movement in collection of the blocked-up assets. We are witnessing delays in certification of the work done and release of payment in projects. This has led to increase in uncertified work done, leading to jump in working capital requirement. Generally, this trend remains in Q1, but we were expecting some improvement in this quarter, but the collections have not moved to a level where we would have expected. Our management is rigorously working towards the collection, and we are confident to turn things around this year. In terms of debt, in Q1 payment issue has continued and operations have been, we had to fund the operations. Also, we have done sizable capex payments this quarter. So, debt has moved to a higher number. On net debt basis, the debt to equity is around 0.68 times of the net worth. On behalf of AFCON, I thank everyone for attending this call. Now, I request a moderator to open the floor for question and answer.

Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and 1 on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Aditya Bhartia from Investec. Please go ahead.

Hi, sir. In the opening remarks, we spoke about some of the execution challenges getting addressed over the next couple of quarters. Just wanted to check, are we seeing some concrete evidence of that? Are we seeing execution phase picking up across multiple projects? Or at this stage, it is a bit of a hope?

At this stage, we are definitely seeing the symptoms of it's all happening, and some of the issues with respect to land-related issues are getting addressed by proactive activities undertaken by Maharashtra government. So that would result in significant release of lands. Whichever places are there, there have been regular reviews from the government which helps in pushing the project ahead. There are similarly in Madhya Pradesh, where we have a project also, where there is a compensation-related issue is getting resolved shortly. Movement has happened. So there also, out of two projects, one project will start moving up immediately. That is what we look. Therefore, the execution-related challenges with respect to blocked-up things is more or less getting over, and with geopolitical issues is becoming a little improved as compared to the last quarter. I would put it, things in terms of movement of materials, though it's a little expensive as compared to the earlier period, it would still be improved in terms of movement of materials for our overseas projects. And with these two, we do expect there are clear indications that things are moving towards positivity. Q3 and Q4, we believe, would see significant uptick.

Perfect, perfect. That's great to hear, Sam. So, my next question is on some of the large projects that we are having, like the Croatia project, the Wadwan project. For these two projects, when should we expect work to start? And is it that the initial part would be more about designing and to that extent there will be lesser revenue accretion and only over a period of time these projects should be picking up? If you could kind of indicate as the execution timelines around that. And a related question is on the HSR project. How should we think about that in terms of receiving payments in respect of past work that is done and execution pays from here on? Thank you so much.

With respect to Crotia, we believe the current year, there will be a miniscule expenditure, and next financial year onwards, Crotia will pick up. With respect to Wadwan project, the alternative methods are being discussed with the client, and currently the approach road and also the reclamation-related work is yet to be completed. And you would have read in the newspaper about the education and all around that. So we are working with the client proactively with the thing, but current year, it will only be a geotechnical investigation and related design-related work and initial installations. That will only happen in Wadhwan. All others, they are also aggressive push from the government also to see that certain facilities or certain approaches are handed over to us. So that we can start the work. So, therefore, in both the projects, effectively, current year, there will be minuscule turnover. With respect to HSR, whatever turnover we have done, all these have been paid for regularly. And the tunneling-related turnover will commence from November, technically. Till that time, the initial drive will happen for about three months. And after that, we do expect a good turnover. As we had conveyed earlier also, tunneling carries higher level of turnover. So, therefore, as we start tunneling deeper, we will get into the turnover properly. We are in the final stages of getting the settlement with respect to force majeure done, and most likely it will get settled in the current quarter.

Perfect, sir. That's great to hear. Thank you so much.

Thanks, Raditya.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, you may press star and 1. A reminder to all the participants to press star and 1 to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Stravan Shah from Dalit Capital. Please go ahead.

Hi, sir. A couple of questions. So I was listening to your opening comments and reply to the first participant questions. So broadly, how, so let me break it into two, three parts. So do we see Q2 revenue? The QQ flat or a lower, and then when we are saying the H2 would be a better execution, I understand though we are not providing the full year guidance on the execution front, but on a directional front, even if we, let's say, assume a 20% kind of growth, is it possible or not, even if that is possible, then for full year, the broad, rough, my calculation says, We will be a kind of a flatties or maybe a 1% kind of a growth. That's the correct way to look at or we can see maybe a 5% plus kind of a degrowth for this year.

So, see, we have already talked about that at this point in time, it doesn't make any sense to give any direction on the top line or any profitability related guidance. So, we are not commenting on the Q2, how it is going to pan out or how the year is going to pan out, but as things stand, things are moving in our, you know, whatever expectations we have, and we aspire that we should, you know, build a very strong order book in this financial year, And we should also improve the balance sheet this year by way of collecting, by way of reducing our contract assets and receival and by reducing our debt. So we should be in a very strong position by end of the year in terms of order booking, in terms of financial health, and then we should ramp up the progress in the year, financial year 28.

Yeah, sir, I understand, but still, again, happening on the same thing, because a directional, because when we are saying that in H2, we should see a strong execution. So, how is the problem? So, my point, listen to me, sir, my point is that because if we will be doing a kind of a flat, because that's what the broad, even if I take a 20% kind of a growth in the second half and maybe a flat in the Q2, that means this will be the fourth year where we will be kind of having a flat revenue from what we have done in the FYR23. From there till now, we will be having a kind of a flat growth. So that's the, and at the same time, at the fat level, we will be drawing or declining. So will FY28 then would be, or maybe 28 and the 29 would be a so strong, maybe a kind of a 25, 30% kind of a growth that we are looking at. That's the direction we wanted to understand.

So, just to answer you, in past, if we see the performance of the company in generally, the Q1 is around say 40-45 percent and Q2 remains to be around, H1 remains to be around 40-45 percent and H2 remains around 55-60 percent. Directionally, if you ask me, we are looking at a similar kind of a situation this year also. So Q3, Q4 is going to be where we will bounce back to the levels we were generating earlier. And in terms of, you know, as the order booking is ramping up and the way we are targeting to reach in terms of financial health, we are looking at a strong FY28 and FY29.

Okay, great. Sir, is it possible to share a couple of balance date data points? Because when we are saying, we have mentioned that I think the date would have also increased. So if you can specify the particularly the gross date and then the cash level and also the some of the inventory, trade payable, data, absolute numbers and maybe mobilization advance, returns and unbuild. So, that will help us to understand how the things are either worsening or maybe at a similar level. So, that would be helpful.

See, generally, the balance sheet numbers are disclosed in H1. So, maybe, you know, in September, we will be coming out with the detailed numbers. So, you will be able to figure out. But in terms of Q1 number, generally, we have seen almost, say, last 10-15 years, we have seen that Q1 numbers will be always, you know, lower than the number of annual number, March number. So, this is the trend. But in terms of absolute debt number, we have talked about that the debt to equity is around 0.68 on net debt to equity basis. And numbers have slightly gone down as compared to the March number. But the way deterioration happened in terms of, say, receivables or debt number or, say, contract assets number in last year Q1, this year it has not gone that bad.

But, sir, unless we give some directional numbers, it would be difficult to kind of quantify what we are saying. So, at least a gross date level, what's the gross date number and working capital days, what was in FY26, and now how much increase has happened? Thank you.

It is at an elevated level as compared to a March number, but since the auditors have not certified the balance sheet number, it will not be prudent on our part to give those numbers.

Yeah, because all other companies also provide, I understand it is an unordered number, but at least to get a sense and how one can pencil in the numbers, unless we have anything on that front, it becomes very, very difficult to kind of pencil in how one can look at the full year and maybe the next year. So, political, sorry, for that, diplomating answer would be difficult to kind of convert into the numbers. So, that's my suggestion. Thanks.

You will be able to calculate these numbers. You look at the March debt number. You look at the March net worth number. And what we are saying that at this point in time, the debt to equity on a net debt basis is around 0.68. So you will be able to calculate it. It's very simple. I am not spelling out because, you know, those numbers have not been audited. So it is not advisable that, you know, we talk about on a public forum these numbers. That's the limit.

You have to very easily calculate. But working capital days, we are not saying anything directly also with how much 10, 20 days increase, something, something.

It has marginally increased from the March number.

Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir.

Thank you.

Thank you. A reminder to all the participants to press star and one to ask a question. The next question is in the line of Bala Subramaniam from Arihan Capital. Please go ahead.

Good morning, sir. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Sir, our execution strategy to prioritize liquidity over maximizing quarterly revenue, basically limiting execution on projects with elongated payments. At the same time, we are focusing on reducing the net debt in this financial via contract asset liquidation. So, like, how we are managing this duality, whether slowing down new work to product cash flow while simultaneously executing existing work to unlock cash. Because our order is also more than 13,000 crores in this quarter. So I'm trying to understand on the exhibition side how we are prioritizing our existing work as well as new work.

So, you are right that, you know, it's a very difficult situation where we need to manage the execution as well as we need to manage liquidity and we are not unduly overexposing ourselves with some of the customers. So, this approach we are not approaching with all the customers. There are certain customers where we had seen that there were some challenges in those projects and in those projects only we are taking such kind of stand like say project in Bangladesh or some water related project. We are giving funds to the project based on the collection that project is generating. Otherwise, in excluding these projects, the payments are forthcoming, The project's cash flows are positive. So, such projects we are supporting with, you know, wherever there is a temporary mismatch and if there is any requirement for the completion of the project.

Our strategic equipment base is nearly 4,300 crores, I think, which creates high depreciation as well as maintenance burden. If you look at last few years, our top links are anywhere between 10,000 to 13,000 crores range, but if you look at our interest cost and our depreciation, it's substantially increased. Is there any thought process or tool strategic shifting towards a satellite model where you can, like, lease specialized equipment or to form a JV with equipment provided for some specific mega project? So, thereby, we can improve OE and ROC profiles. So, what's your thought process on owning most of the equipments, as well as moving towards leasing or renting the equipments?

For strategic equipments only, we keep investing. We don't invest in all the equipments, number one. Number two, as we had explained in the past also, In, outside of India, especially in Africa and all, the cost of rentals are very high. The equipment value is sought to be realized in nine months' time in Africa, as opposed to some 48 to 60 months in India. Therefore, in some of those cases also, we do invest equipments. On the higher side, and we get commensurate returns as well. Third, in marine, we hold strategic advantage by having a large fleet of equipments. And that is something which helps us in some of backing of marine projects and other things. And only thing, as last couple of years, our turnovers stagnated or slightly regrown, degrown. It creates an impression that it is on the higher side. It is not so. As we move forward, you will find that we have an asset turnover ratio also significantly improved. So, we have not invested in any assets which is not of strategic importance.

Got it, sir. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is on the line of Abhinav from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. My question is first on the pipeline. You mentioned about 1.5 trillion for the next nine months. Can you break that across the segments?

Sure. For the nine months out of this 1.5 lakh crores, Major chunk is from urban infrastructure, which for us comprises of metro and elevated bridges and elevated roads, that is around 34%. Marine is 32%. Hydro and underground is 20%. It includes our water business as well. Surface, which is road and railway business, that is 14%. And And this pipeline is for the next nine months.

Understood. And, sir, any color on the long-term pipeline, you mentioned about 3.9 trillion.

Sure. So, on the long-term pipeline, as MDs have mentioned in his speech, our long-term pipeline is close to 4 lakh crores. In this part also, the pipeline is evenly distributed. Around 36% is from the urban infrastructure space. And the surface transport will be around 20%. The hydro business will be relatively less, it's around 15%. And the remainder will be marine and industrial.

Sir, can you give some details on the urban project, which are the big ticket projects that are coming in the near term?

Some of the big-ticket projects we can talk about is Brahmaputra tunnel is something which is coming up, which is around 19,000 crores, and there is Dolera connectivity in Ahmedabad which is about 18,000 crores, and many other projects of the size of elevated expressways and other things are coming in excess of all around 4,000 to 5,000 crores. There are a number of bridges which are coming up, which is also in the region of between 3,000 to 5,000 crores. So we have a strong pipeline in the domestic market, and similarly in the international market also, there is quite a good pipeline available to us.

Understood. So my last question is on the depreciation of TBM. How will that be accounted for?

So TBM, we are accounting for as per the Companies Act prescribed rate, and we will continue to account for those depreciations.

I understand. Thank you, sir.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Parveskazi from Nuwama Group. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hi. Good afternoon, and thanks for taking my question. So, a couple of questions from my side. First, what was the JPEG that we undertook in Q1?

So, capex in Q1, we have done close to 150 crores capitalized, but then there is a sizable amount in CWIP.

Possible to quantify that, or let me, same as, more or less same as what it was at the end of March, I think we had almost 900 crores of CWIP, if I am correct.

Yeah, similar number is there.

On the order intake front, we already have won about 50,000 crores this year. So for the year as a whole, fair to say somewhere around 30,000 crores is something that we can look at?

Yes, 30,000 crores we are very confident of working at the minimum. Sure.

And last question to Ramesh. Are other income, I mean, which you mentioned about 57 odd crore. This year now, I assume forex gains, etc. Everything is included in that. For the year as a whole, what kind of number that could be? Because, I mean, it has come down. We used to have almost about 54, 74, 74 odd crore.

So what number you are talking about in other income around 450, 470 crore, it used to be a combination of these factors like say arbitration interest, foreign currency gain and the miscellaneous income and some of the other stuff also like insurance claim and other stuff. Now, uh... For this quarter, the number is low, because we also try to close things in March, wherever possible, and the activity also goes up in H2. So, this year also, we will be in the range of, say, for the year, somewhere around 400 or so.

Sure. Thanks and all the best. Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Atidra Banurjee from Nomura. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hi. Thanks for the opportunity. So, just on the order in front, because we've already, you know, recorded such as the order in close, what is the upside risk that will, you know, overshoot the 30,000 order into target 5527?

We would say that first let us achieve the 30,000 crores, then we will see what is the upside we are in a position to make it. And currently we are at 16,000, and we hope as we proceed, we will be in a position to guide you better. And today's guidance is 30,000 crores.

Understood, sir.

And another question that I had was the overseas projects that we have undertaken, supposedly, Croatian.

So, between a domestic project and overseas projects, which is likely to have a better, you know, margin profile? I understand that it's dependent on the building and etc. But typically, what's the margin differential between, you know, overseas and domestic projects, if you could give a sense of that?

So, in overseas projects, we generally make better margin. And the margin, the delta in, say, domestic versus overseas is around 200 to 300 basis points, which is higher in overseas market. And whatever project we are targeting in overseas market, The margins, the specific margin will not be able to give you what margin we generally target, but then domestic market, whether it is overseas market, the margins are better in the overseas market.

Understood. Those are my two questions. Thanks for the opportunity and all the best for coming forward.

Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Vishal Perival from PL Capital. Please go ahead.

Yes, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, in terms of our profit and loss account, what could be the reason for declining in the depreciation? Any link with the revenue that we book or what is the reason behind that?

No, sir. Depreciation, there is no link to the revenue because generally depreciation is a time-related cost. So the number has come down because as I explained in the opening commentary, in this period we did not have too much of tunneling related activity and we have explained in past that we used to do accelerated depreciation on the tunnel boring machine basis the running meters it used to excavate. So this period hardly there was any TBM related tunneling activity. That is why the number has come down.

No, which means it is linked with the revenue, right?

No, it is linked with the revenue only to the extent of PBM, which was not there in this quarter. Okay, fine.

And second thing is, in terms of execution, you did clarify in the previous questions. But if one has to pinpoint, our order book is relatively young, initial stage, and execution could pick up as the quarter progresses. And that is one thought. Another is probably like, you know, there are the delays in the payment from the client and as the clients are delaying, they're not able to pull the money or probably like, you know, deploy the money back in the working capital and other things which could improve execution. So how, how, which one directionally you will pinpoint and then like, you know, the reason of muted the execution.

See, as we explained that the order book... Whatever we have booked till now say around 16,000 crores of order. These orders to convert in revenue it will take some time. And the order what we were having in hand on say around 32,000 crores. In such projects there were a couple of projects which were moving slow. And then in some of the other projects there were some land acquisition related issues or there were some change in scope related stuff. So the work fronts were not available. Because of that, there was a muted revenue in this quarter. As things stand, we expect the execution to significantly pick up from Q3 onwards, and so we will have a very strong H2, and all these orders, whatever we have booked, and the balance period in this year, whatever orders we are going to book, we will have a very sizable order booking in our hands, matured for construction for the next financial year, FY28. So, that's where we are looking at that FY28 will have a sizeable ramp up. In terms of execution?

Sure. Okay, sure, sir, and thanks for the answers, and I'll come back in the queue, sir. Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Rahul Bhutra from Anand Rati Share and Stockbrokers Limited. Please go ahead.

Hello, sir. Sir, my question is regarding the test flow from operation. Is it negative for this quarter also?

No, I didn't get the question.

What is that? The case flow from operation, is it negative for this quarter also?

Yes, so cash flow from operations generally in Q1 remains to be negative because in past also we have explained that customers what they try to do is they will try to release all the payment in up-to-date payment in March quarter. And Q1 they devote their time for planning and budgeting for the next financial year. So there is less activity in Q1 from the customer and payment also remains to be slow in Q1. So cash flow is negative.

Okay, so thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Bhavik Shah from NVEXA Capital LLP. Please go ahead.

Hi, sir. My question is regarding our JJM order book and receivables. Can you quantify the amount of the orders pending in order book and how much receivables we are still yet to receive?

So, in Jaljeev and Mission, all put together, we have got 1221 crores of total order, in which from the UP, the balance order is 510 crores, Madhya Pradesh is 414 crores, and Rajasthan is 297 crores. Among this, in Madhya Pradesh, we are not having any major problem because whatever work we are executing, we are getting paid. And in Rajasthan also payments are partly coming. Major problem is in UP where the payments, recent time they have started making payments because wherever we have completed the last mile connectivity, the payments have started flowing in. But then it is not that significant corresponding to the receivable we have. So, in past also we have explained that in U.P. we were having close to 400 crores of receivable. From there we have received a very small fraction. So, for all practical purposes, the receivable remains to be in the similar level.

Understood, sir. And what will be the unbilled amount, sir?

So, this amount what we are talking about is a combination of receivable plus unbilled.

Understood, sir. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ashok Shah from Eklavya Invesco Family Office. Please go ahead.

Thanks for taking my question. Sir, we have very good order book position, but over the last few years, we are facing an execution problem or some different type of problem, maybe land and everything different. So, what's the problem or how we are managing or going to increase the turnover or education level or what percentage of the sizable order is slow moving? Can you explain why I said it?

See, we have explained in the last quarter earnings call on some of the issues which is being factored in. If you look at the overall order book value, roughly around 5.65% is loan-willing category, and Bangladesh orders constitute about 2%, and another about 3% constitutes Jaljiwan mission orders. So, these three put together roughly around 11% is what we can categorize or either slow-moving or otherwise. In some of the other cases, as we had explained, there have been initial right-of-way and related issues which is getting resolved. That is why we are saying that third and fourth quarter, it will pick up better, and with the proactive involvement of the government of Maharashtra. And there have been a lot of improvements in such areas, which in the past had contributed a bit. Now with the proactive involvement, things are getting resolved, and projects will be available for execution. And otherwise, we have already started in the water portion and other things. Land portion also we will commence in the second half of the year. So, with that, things will improve. So, these are the, when nearly about 11% of the orders are slow moving or other things, and another about, roughly about 20% of the orders are in the initial phase, then that is where there are challenges in terms of converting it into turnover, which will start improving in the second half year.

So, sir, as stated in the call, sir, we do plan to reduce our debt over the year by March. So, what is the size we are seeing to reduce our debt?

Yeah, so debt we will look at a sizable reduction. And this year, as we said that we had to make payment for some of the capital equipment we have bought. Despite all that, we see that we will see improvement, the number what we have clocked in FY26, from that number we will see some improvement. At least there will be some 5 to 10 percent improvement from that number. We are looking at debt closing say around 3,500 or so.

So it will be reduced by how much consolidated level around 300 to 400 crore?

No, so what we are talking about from FY26 debt number, we are looking at a similar number, but then this year we will be making payment close to say around 700 to 800 quotes towards capital. Despite that, we will see improved, we will acclog the similar number on the debt front. In terms of working capital, you know, the similar amount of improvement will be there.

So, the 700 is a... Sorry, sorry. Yes.

So what I was trying to explain that the debt number in absolute terms will be similar number what we have clocked in March 26. But since we have done, we will be doing a sizable capex this year. In working capital, we will see the improvement. So that's where I was saying that we will see around 5 to 10 percent improvement in working capital. That is bare minimum.

So, net debt will be reduced by 700 crores, or it will be lower than that?

Net debt will be reduced. Net debt will be somewhere around, say, 2700, 2800 crores kind of number.

Thank you, sir. Thank you. And best wishes for current year. Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is in the line of Aditra Banerjee from Numura. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hi. Thanks for the opportunity for the follow-up question. So, just one understanding I wanted to have. So, regarding this JV Loader and Higher Taxes that you were mentioning about, so how are they accounted in the P&L statement? Just wanted an understanding on that.

So, you are asking about JV accounting or you are asking about the JV tax?

So, tax, basically, so why the tax went up this year, this quarter? So, just wanted to understand where that part is accounted in the penal statement.

So, it goes as a tax in whatever JV pays tax that goes as a tax in the respective entity and then in consolidation that forms part of tax. Because most of these JVs are forming part of the standalone financial itself. So, it gets incorporated in standalone financial as well. Now, specifically, I was trying to explain for this quarter, because in AFCONs, the profitability was low, in terms of percentage, it is appearing to be around, say, 40%. But the amount, if you see, per se, is not that big number. It is around, say, 4-5 crore. Had we had, maybe, say, 150-200 crore kind of a profit in Ascon, what we were clocking for so many quarters, this 4 crore will not make that tax percentage a big number.

Okay, but in that case, your tax would have also gone up, right? This quote that you are saying, that would have also gone up in that case. So, just want to have a bit more clarity on that.

No, so, see, in AFCONs, we are making, so, most of the entities, we are making tax payment in the range of 25% or so. Just because that this quarter in some of the entities, some of the closed projects entities, we had to incur some administrative costs because, you know, in such entities we are following up with customers for collections and some other closer aspects are not closed. And in such entities we are required to make ECL provision on the receivables. Because of that we are looking at a, in those entities we are looking at a lost kind of a situation because the projects are completed. So, all these administrative expenses, ECL provisions are coming as an only cost. And because of that, the consolidated profitability is coming down. Whatever, you know, loss we are incurring in these entities, because of that, the tax rate is going up, despite paying, say, 25-26% tax only.

Got it, got it. Thank you for answering your question.

Thank you.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, you may press star and 1. A reminder to all the participants to press star and 1 to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Shravan Shah from Dolat Capital. Please go ahead.

Hi, sir. Thank you for the opportunity again. Sir, for capex, you said in this quarter, we have done a 150 crore capex, but on the cash flow front, this number must be on the higher side.

Yes, because some of the amount which was on 31st March, which was in CWIP, for that, we had to make payment in the quarter.

Okay, but for full year, FY27, we are looking at 700, 800 crore capex.

Yes.

And for next year, given till now, whatever the orders that we have back, what broader number one can look at in terms of the capex for FY28?

So in FY28, we are looking at capex in the range of, say, 600, 650 crores.

Okay, okay. And given the depreciation, as you said, maybe the from November when the TBM full phase will start. So even in Q2, the similar kind of 83, 85 crore kind of a depreciation should be there and for full year, how much one can look at in terms of the lower depreciation versus F426?

You have rightly picked it up. As the TBM related activity starts, there will be a corresponding depreciation coming into play because the TBMs are in the initial drive and it is still sitting in the CWIP and once it gets capitalized, then the corresponding depreciation will start coming in. So, in H2, there will be a higher depreciation definitely vis-a-vis this number what we are looking at in Q1. But then, correspondingly, revenue will go up and it is fully factored in all our calculations what we look at and it will reflect accordingly.

So, but, but whatever way, even if you look at the full year depreciation, definitely would be a lower versus F.26 of 454 crore. Because even if we take up 83 crore this quarter and the next quarter also similar number 160 and then even if it picks up to 130 crore. Then also this number, is it fair to say or should be close to 400 odd crore or even less than that?

See, we will not be able to give you that number, but then maybe for all practical purposes, you can consider FY26 depreciation number.

Okay, okay. And for finance cost, this quarter, and the ECL provision, so was there any ECL provision in this quarter? And on the finance cost, how one can look at the finance cost?

So, as far as ECL provisioning is concerned, we have explained last time that we have made a framework for ECL provisioning and which was approved by the board and which was, you know, we had taken professional guidance from experts in this particular field and basis that framework was devised and basis that framework we have started making provisioning from last year and we continue to do the provisioning on that basis. No specific provision as such in any project because we believe that any such eventuality, I mean, we don't foresee any such eventuality going forward. And whatever project specific provisioning we had to do last time, on a company basis, if we evaluate, let's say, last 20, 25 years, maybe, you know, those were abrasions because such instance we never had. It was maybe, say, at MAC, I can say 1%, 2% kind of a possibility. So we don't foresee going forward such kind of provisioning will be required, but then on a prudent basis, we have made a very robust provisioning mechanism and taking guidance from professionals and this is that we have been making provision. As far as finance cost is concerned, as we said that the debts are higher than what was in the March. And in terms of client advances, the interest bearing advances continues to be on the similar level what we were having for the last three, four quarters. Similar numbers, so the finance costs are also on the similar lines. In terms of average borrowing cost, if you ask me, we have brought it down. We have significantly brought it down. Many high cost debts we have replaced with low cost debt. So from operational aspects, whatever control on things we have, we have done our bit and that's where despite debt going up, the finance cost has not significantly gone up. But once we see, you know, improvement in collection and all, we will see a mark reduction in the finance cost.

Okay. Okay. And lastly, in Q1 revenue, can you break it down into domestic and international, what would be the share?

See, in terms of revenue from overseas market, as in March, we had shown that the overseas revenue had come down to around 13 percent. So, in Q1, we are having overseas revenue around 16 percent. From overseas market, domestic is 84 percent. But now, the order mix is changing. At the moment, the order book, what we have, we have moved back to around, say, 25 percent We hope that we will go back to 30% from overseas market, that is for minimum, and then as if the order book moves 30% from overseas market, revenue also will go back to 30% from overseas market.

Okay, and balance, whatever we are looking at close to 14,000, 15,000 crore kind of order inflow, there also one can say sizable should be from the international market.

Yes, yes.

Okay, okay. Thank you and all the best. Thank you.

Thank you. As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to management for closing comments.

Thank you very much. Thanks for your continued support, and we look forward to an exciting period ahead. Thank you all.

On behalf of DAM, Capital Advices Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.