Mastek Limited (MASTEK) Q3 2026 Earnings Call Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Mastec Limited Q3 FY26 Earnings Conference Call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference, please signal an operator by pressing star and then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Prateek Jakta from EY Investor Relations. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you, Darwin. Good evening to all of you, and welcome to QP FY26 Earnings Call of MassTech Limited. The results and presentation have already been mailed to you, and you can also view it on our website, www.masstech.com. To take us through the results today and to answer your questions, we have the top management of Mastec, represented by Umang Mahata, the CEO of the company, and Deepak Kadia, Chief Financial Officer. Umang will start the call with business update for the quarter, which will be then followed by Deepak, who will take us through the financials. And post that, we will open the floor for Q&A session. As usual, I would like to remind you that anything mentioned in this call that reflects any outlook for the future or which can be construed as a forward-looking statement must be viewed in conjunction with the risks and uncertainties that we face. These risks and uncertainties are included but not limited to what we have mentioned in the prospectus file with SEBI and the subsequent annual report that you can find on our website. Having said that, I will now hand over the call to Umang Nahata. Over to you, Umang.

Thank you, Prateek. Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the Q3 earnings call for Mass Effect Limited. In our call today, we share some of the developments that have happened in this quarter and as the momentum and outlook that we look forward to. Q3 continued to be a quarter of strengthening some of our core fundamentals. Especially around our capability stack, our domain expertise, as well as our leadership teams. It has also been a quarter where we had to navigate the headwinds of a seasonally weak quarter, while continued focus on operational efficiency and AI-led productivity gains ensured that we delivered a robust bottom-line performance. Talking about capability growth, digital engineering is the fundamental capability of MassTech. It has been a core of our, you know, sustained growth and delivery. With AI, our digital engineering capability has now seen a revived energy and expansion. In this quarter, we've been recognized by some of the leading analyst firms as one of the leading performers as far as mid-market digital engineering is concerned. A lot of this has been backed by the sustained quality and productivity improvement that we have been able to offer to our clients, ranging from between 15% to 80% improvements in terms of the AIA-led engineering capability. This is also a continued investment in the AI capability has now eliminated the gap as far as technology differentiator that we had between us and some of the other larger players in the market, giving us the opportunity to compete for much larger core digital engineering or AI-led engineering deals. Similarly, on the Oracle front, Oracle has been a key strength area for us, and we continue to be recognized by Oracle as one of their top partners globally. Having said that, Oracle's Business direction is also significantly moving towards AI-led transformation deals. And in that journey, Oracle sees us as amongst their top 20 partners globally who is leading their AI initiatives. In fact, we were awarded three key recognitions during the AI world that happened earlier in the quarter as a leading performer in Oracle's AI-led transformation journey. From a domain front, our focus on healthcare and life sciences continues to be a key area. We've been investing both in terms of people as well as assets and accelerators to deliver a significant differentiated capability in these areas. Our learning and experience out of working at NHS as well as various payer and provider organizations globally has now been consolidated into a singular strength which is allowing us to compete in much larger businesses and deals globally. Another key development as far as capability for this quarter has been our renewed strength in financial services sector. As you all are aware, we had won one large deal earlier in the year with Bank of England. And now this quarter, we are very happy to announce that we've won one new large account in a super $20 million deal. This, backed by, for the first time, us being recognized as a contender in the financial services sector by various analyst firms, gives us the confidence of developing financial services as the third sector after healthcare and public sector for MassTech. We continue to focus on enhancing our data capabilities as well as our salesforce capabilities aligned to these vertical sectors that we have looked at. All of this capability and domain strengths have now also resulted in improvement in our 12-month, as well as our total order backlog. So, our 12-month order backlog has grown by 18.4%, whereas our total order backlog has grown by more than 30% year over year. Coming down to the Q3 performance from a revenue standpoint, Q3 experienced some expected and a few unexpected turbulences or headwinds that we saw, resulting in a 4.8% constant currency reduction in our revenue. We saw a higher furlough in UK as well as in some of our public sector customers globally. Additionally, this is also a quarter where many of our... Many transformation programs, especially Oracle programs, went live during the quarter. However, the newer programs, the start of the new programs, have been ride-shifted and will start in Q4. Many of those are scheduled to start in Q4. This has led to, you know, this, you know, reduction in our top-line performance. Having said that, despite the reduction in the top-line performance, Our continuous and sustained focus on operational rigor, as well as driving AI-led productivity improvement in our internal operations, is really helping us hold our bottom-line performance. In fact, we have improved our EBITDA margin by 60 basis points, despite the one-time labor law changes, which Deepa will explain in the later part of the call. We're hoping and looking forward to maintaining a steady bottom-line performance, and as promised, we feel that we will continue to improve in our bottom-line performance over the next coming period. Looking ahead, we feel that the global demand that we see, especially across healthcare and life sciences, is really strong in UK as well as across all geographies in US and India. And our capabilities, both from a domain as well as from a horizontal standpoint, are now really well aligned to address this growing demand. And our growth in this vertical is going to be fundamental to our long-term sustained growth as we move forward. From a people leadership standpoint also, we now had Deepak Kadia joining us in this quarter. We also had two important leadership hirings in our data as well as in our Salesforce capability. This marks almost the completion of all the leadership changes that we wanted to drive, and we now have a very cohesive and empowered leadership team daring to go for long-term growth of the organization. One last area while we continue to focus on business and drive sustained growth are Our commitment to our social responsibility also continues to be an important area of focus, and we're very pleased to share that we've been recognized amongst the top 10 companies globally on our environment scores, and that makes us also proud in terms of not only are we delivering well to our business, but also continuing to deliver well for the society in general. With that, I'll hand over the call to Deepak to share more details on our financial performance. Deepak, over to you.

Thank you, Umang. A very warm welcome to everyone on the call, wishing you all a very happy new year. As Umang already covered the business aspect, I'll focus more on the financial and operational levers. We reported an operating revenue of INR 905.7 crores, which was up 4.2% Y-on-Y. On a sequential basis, it reflects a 3.7% decline in IRR terms. This is as highlighted by UMAM. It's majorly due to seasonal headwinds and some one-time events in Q3. Coming on profitability, Q3 had two headwinds. One was seasonal around furloughs and holidays, and the second one is labor code changes. I'll cover labor code changes in a few minutes. In spite of our bow, we have delivered yet another strong quarter of growth in EBITDA, improving by 60 BPS points to 16.1%. Out of 60 BPS points, 43 BPS points reflect our resiliency towards AI-led operational efficiency, and 17 BPS points are due to Forex headwinds. Or Forex headwinds, my bad. Again, my bad. Forex headwinds. EBITDA includes an impact of 6.4 crores on a count of labor code changes. As we are aware, there are some clarifications which are awaited from the Labor Department, and hence we expect an adjustment in Q4. There were some one-time benefits which we got in Q3 which helped us negate this impact. Those one-time benefits were around leave at onsite. Our net profit improved to 11.7% with improvement of 149 basis points quarter and quarter. Across all Jio's, we have expanded our margin in Q3, further underlining the execution of our operational efficiency. Based on business fundamentals mentioned by Umang, we continue to add new customers to our portfolio. We have added 17 new customers in Q3. This is also reflecting in our backlog position, where in 12-month order backlog for the quarter now stands at $296 million, reflecting a growth of 5.7% quarter-on-quarter and 18.4% Y-on-Y. We continue to maintain a very strong balance sheet and healthy cash position. Our net cash is 346 crores INR versus 135 crores last quarter. We added operating cash of almost 210 crores in quarter three. Our DSO for the quarters stood at 84 days, which is a slight increase from 80 days last quarter. This was primarily due to administrative delay in collections in the UK on account of holiday season. We see this as a temporary thing, and DSO will start improving from next quarter as we continue to have a reverse collection, which is reflecting our cash position. Based on all the cash collection and everything, we are declaring an interim dividend of repeats 8 per share, which is at 160%. Our closing headcount was 4676 versus 4745 last quarter. This is, again, after a consistent focus on improving our productivity and driving better outcomes for our customer at the same time. Our utilization rate dropped to 76.7% including trainees versus 81.8% in the previous quarter. Again, this is a reflection of the higher reliefs, which is both led by festivals, holidays, and time furloughs during the quarter. With that, I thank you, everyone. I look forward to your continued trust and support in Mastik. I'll go back to Prateek to open the house for Q&A.

Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and 1 on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to please use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Our first question comes from the line of Sukrit D. Patil from iSight FinTrade Private Limited. Please go ahead.

Good morning to the team. I have two questions. My first question to Mr. Upanth is, as MassTech continues to expand its AI first and digital engineering portfolio, what specific initiatives are being taken to deepen the client relationships in the U.S. and AMEA markets? Over the next 12 to 18 months, how do you see the company balancing near-term revenue volatility with long-term growth opportunities in AI and cloud transformation? Thank you. That's my first question. I'll ask you second question after this.

Thank you, Sukrit. As we had mentioned earlier in my narrative, AI is definitely, you know, bringing the technology differentiation between the various IT services providers to a near, making them all very equal. All the assets, accelerators, as well as capabilities are now starting to, you know, align a lot between players. What is going to be important is how we offer this back to our customers and create a win-win scenario with them. Our current approach is to, you know, move from time and material contracts to more outcome-based contracts. In fact, in this quarter, also, we have closed a few deals where we have moved our customers from time and material to an outcome-based contract and also offering anywhere between a 15% to 30% savings on productivity over a three-year tenure. These contracts, while might have a short-term impact on our top-line performance, but are really important to deliver and build confidence in the customer from a trust as well as capability standpoint to, you know, recognize the kind of benefits that AI is providing to them. I am very sure that as we aggressively offer this benefit to our existing customers, it is creating the space required within the customers and the mindshare for them to consider us in much larger businesses and awards. And as we get into those larger deals, it will create a much more bigger impact for us. As you know, our digital presence in North America has been quite small, but this AI-led engineering is now starting to create a much bigger digital engineering pipe in the geography, especially as we, you know, go out as champion challengers to many new customers. So, it's a case of, you know, trying to transform your, you know, balance your capability and quality strengths by...

Thank you. My second question is to Mr. Kedia. With operating margin improving to 16% despite revenue showing some softness, how are you planning to balance cost discipline with investment in talent and delivery capacity? Could you share how MassTech is approaching capital allocation to support both shareholder returns and long-term growth in AI-driven services? Thank you.

So, Chris, if you're okay, I'll work with Deepak on the answer. See, there are… Well, it's a very fair question, right, in terms of long-term and how do we look at balancing and continuing our cost efficiency as well as trying to address investment in AI as well as investing in these where we have to offer productivity benefits to our customers. Our current expectation is the... So, AI investments will continue. However, as we move towards more and more fixed-bit projects, like an outcome-based contract, that allows us to share the gain and maintain a healthy operational efficiency on our side. Because while we are offering a part of the benefit to the clients, it also allows us to maintain a part of the… You know, the savings to MassTech also, and that's been reflecting in our continued quarter on quarter bottom line performance. So there's a stringent bottom line improvement target, productivity improvement target across all programs, as well as our G&A spend that we look forward to. Having said that, we are also looking at a scenario where, you know, as we grow our top line, because the volume performance is important, and I'm pretty sure these AI-led differentiations are going to drive, you know, much higher volume improvements, the overall impact on bottom line will be much healthier as we move forward. So, the impact of investment versus return, I think the ROI is much highly tilted towards positive return. So, why do we have to make these earlier initial investments, both in terms of capability as well as... Thank you for the

guidance, and I wish the entire team best of luck for the next one.

Thank you. Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Amit Chandra from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. And also, you can explain... In terms of the decline that we have seen in this quarter, what has been, you know, the contribution from the furloughs that we have seen in terms of extended furloughs, and also, you know, you mentioned about the EI-led productivity benefits that we have to provide to clients. So, if you can quantify what led to the decline in terms of the extended furlough and the electroactivity benefits, and also in terms of, you said, some of the contracts that were supposed to start. So, that will be the first question. And also, in terms of the benefits that you have been mentioning, so what percentage of the clients we are seeing this? And is it also happening primarily in the, you know, large government accounts?

So, thank you, Amit, for the question. I'll take the first part of the question, and I'll hand over for the second part to Umang. In terms of decline in revenue, our furlough impact was almost $2.7 million for the current quarter, and the rest was basically related to those ramp-downs or the closure of the project and some of the delays which has happened, a right-shifting of the project which has happened because of a delay in ramp-up. So that's the impact, or that turns into your first question.

Amit, on the focus on business in terms of offering these commercial benefits to our clients, it is happening across a large number of our customers and existing engagements. And these also include some of our public sector engagements that we have in the UK. So the general efficiency asked from the clients is through across most of the engagements. So usually these asks come up at the time of renewal. So whenever we are renewing our contracts, you know, these have come up for an ask. However, we are taking a very different approach with the business. We are actually proactively going out and sharing some of these benefits to our clients. And therefore, creating a mind space of, you know, expanding within the account. If you look at our large install base, especially the large account install base, the top 30 odd customers that we have, our current wallet share in almost all of these accounts is a very small portion as compared to the overall digital spend that they have. We see this as an opportunity, while they've always seen us as performing good work and good CSAC performance, but now with differentiated capability and our ability to demonstrate cost-benefit to them and the proactiveness in our commercial acumen. This is creating an opportunity for us being evaluated for larger businesses in these accounts. So we are taking that as an investment in these accounts to create credibility as well as, you know, trust for generating larger opportunities in the same. But this is not a few accounts here and there. It is happening across the board.

Okay. And in continuation to this, are we seeing any extended furloughs continuing maybe in the quarter four? And also, you know, if you can, you know, If you can give some more color in terms of what's happening in the Middle East geography, because there we have seen some very sharp decline. And the last call you mentioned that we are almost, you know, the restructuring there is almost over. So, is it something new that has happened there or, you know, if you can give some more color there?

Yeah, no, thank you, Amit, for pointing that out. So, we don't see any furlough impact going further, any significant furlough impact going further. There might be a few cases, but nothing meaningful there. So, that's for that. As far as our Middle East business is concerned, you are right. We had pointed out that there is a war revenue that we couldn't recognize in Q2, which we were hoping to recognize in Q3. While we have got the letter of award and out there, the documentation, but public sector Middle East sometimes signing the contracts has taken a little longer than anticipated. The business is well secured and already executed. We are confident that we will get the order in, and we are hoping that it will come in January itself, and therefore, we will be able to... Bring it back in our next quarterly performance. Having said that, the second part of the business that I mentioned that a lot of projects went live, some of those go lives were in the Middle East geography. Middle East largely follows Jan to December calendar. And as you can understand, Oracle programs are many times linked to, you know, financially a closer. So we had seen some go lives there. However, The ramp ups are still shifted towards right, and we are looking for a much stronger order book in Q4, which will then, you know, take us forward into continued growth. So, yeah, I would say we're a one quarter delay from where we were hoping the sustained growth would come, but it's just a one quarter shift of right. We're confident that this will start sustainably growing from this quarter onwards.

Okay. And, you know, the last question from my side. Obviously, we have seen some of the larger peers, you know, We are entering into the UK government geography and they have been announcing some new, larger contracts. So, just in general, are we seeing some increased competition out there in the UK government? Because earlier, we were having the advantage that we were present there and the competition from the Indian peers. was comparatively lower, but now we are seeing like, you know, high aggression from the other players also. So are you seeing that also impacting us and forcing us to give in more discounts?

See, as far as the UK public sector and healthcare business is concerned, we believe this, so it's a market that was largely with the global SIs or, you know, some of the local pairs. There was hardly any Indian, large Indian SI contingent in that particular segment. And I think the openness for them to accepting larger Indian SIs to do large pieces of work, so the couple of billion dollar deals that were announced, actually is a positive sign for them considering us as equal competitive partners in delivering larger and more significant, you know, pieces of execution. As we've been saying, our current headroom, so the revenue that we have, so around 150 odd million pounds that we deliver, as compared to the, you know, 4 billion plus overall addressable market that we have is very, very small. And while we have been trying to grow in terms of larger deals, I think this mindset change I see as a positive from a perception of the ability of mid and large Indian IT services companies being contended for delivering larger deals. So I think it's a positive. While I also agree with you in some of our accounts, we would see them as competitive, you know, on those fronts. But I think that's the usual competitiveness. I don't think anything unusual there. I have very strong faith in the kind of client relationships, as well as the capability that we have developed in UK public sector and healthcare. are very differentiated, and I see, you know, healthy momentum in terms of that market.

Okay, thank you and all the rest.

Thank you. Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Devashish Mazumdar from Swann Investments. Please go ahead.

Hi, good evening. Thank you so much for taking my question. So, Umang, I have a three-part question. First one is partly asked by Amit. I just want to get more sense on that. You have said that around 2.5% kind of degrowth has come because of the furloughs, right?

No, I mentioned an amount of $2.7 million. So again, to reiterate, almost 50% of our impact is because of furloughs. Rest, 50% is on account of two things, which is early completion of project towards the early part of the quarter and rise shifting of certain projects.

Okay, if you can add some geographic context into it, how much of this furloughs and ramdowns are related to your UK projects, UK and Europe related projects, how much is those for, you know, US related projects, if you can give some color on that.

Yes.

So, Devashi's large portion of the furlough impact is in UK. As you know, the largest business is in UK. But there has been some impact in our US business also on furlough because we have a small public sector business in North America. I don't know if you have the exact number there, but it's a percentage-wise, a much larger percentage of the furlough impact has come from UK only. As far as the other businesses are concerned, 70% of the furlough impact has come from UK.

Okay. And if I understand correctly, our UK public sector businesses normally, historically, haven't seen much of furlough impact in the past. And especially we are sitting in a quarter where most of our peers who have reported numbers have not mentioned or not in their numbers. We have not seen much of furlough impact. So is it like very specific, client-specific that we are seeing here or anything specific that has happened in this quarter or something like that or it's a normal seasonality according to?

No, Devashi, this is normal seasonality. I think we report this every Q3 consistently across last few years. So, it's something that happens every year-end. The government and some of the public sector businesses shut down for the year-end breaks. And so, it's not unusual. It's very usual, and it was expected that we will get such kind of a farewell part.

And the ramp-down or ride-shifting of the project is also linked to your top customer or it is some new customer or some other customer that you are facing?

So, I mean, there are some important large programs that have gone live. So, those are definitely there in our larger customer list. But if you look at our current nature of business, especially on our Oracle service line, it's a lot more project-driven. So as the projects go live, the revenue starts ramping down, and we usually have a stronger backfill of new deals aligned so that we could move the revenue, continue to sustain the revenue growth. However, the newer program is actually... The start has been delayed by a few weeks and months, so we're hoping to get the start again in Q4, and we should be able to cover that. It's not like any permanent thing, but this is the usual nature of business. Almost 60% of our Oracle business is project-driven, which would ramp down once the project goes live, and then as you win new projects, it ramps up again.

Okay, so I just wanted to get what is the kind of confidence level you have to get a sequential growth coming back into in the UK market?

Sorry, can you repeat that question, Devashis?

I'm asking that sequentially, can you get back into the growth in Q4 in UK market, UK and Europe market?

So, UK, Europe, we have really good demand that we see as far as our healthcare and, you know, businesses concerned. We're also going through some important renewals in our existing secured government services customers. We generally feel positive, having said that, there is also continued pressure from the government to at least deliver a 15% or higher efficiency across all government projects. So that's one part of the business that we are still navigating, which may have some short-term or continued short-term impact.

If I know correctly, last year when the renewals happened in your large-size public sector contract in UK, you have passed on certain price benefits or productivity benefits to them already. With this thought that until next renewal, we don't need to pass anything. So is there any change in structure there?

Yeah, so while we had passed, you are right, we passed almost 5% to 10% benefit to our customers when we got them into renewal last year. Having said that, the government, as they reorganize their spend, so there's a lot more spend happening on healthcare and defense, and all other departments have been asked to bring down their spend that they have on all other departments, including some of the other larger customers that we work with. So this is over and above the discounts that we had given last year.

Okay, understood. And my last question is around the U.S. market. We have seen a significant fall in this quarter. And if I see before the last acquisition you did in U.S., you used to do a $20 to $23 million quarterly run rate, which moved up to around $30 million post-acquisition. And we have actually come back to $20 to $23 million today. Okay. So just trying to get some sense that what is the progress in the US market. If I remember correctly, last time when we discussed, you told us that US market will take three to four quarters time at least to settle down. Considering that US market has started coming back for a few of your peers, do you see US market settling down or do you think it's three, four quarters away for us?

No, we've, like I said earlier, U.S. market required some core fundamental changes to our business. We've made most of those fundamental corrections already. So, first, in terms of capability, like I said, our core digital engineering capability, which we wanted to take to North America, is now competitive and seeing good traction, which is allowing us to offer many of these AI-led engineering services. These are participating there. Two, we wanted an overall of our North America team. So, we've got almost all the leadership team under startup and the capability as well as sector leaders now in place. So, we have a strong team, 100% team changes that we have executed already. Third is, like I mentioned earlier, the direction of travel will be visible in two steps. We first start seeing improvement in our order book and backlog, and which will then be supported by revenue growth. Our order book numbers are now starting to change shape. So, a North America order book, for example, has... We've delivered a 30 million-plus order book in this quarter, and we see sustained order book momentum in the coming quarters, and it will keep growing from there. So we believe as we have now got into the turnaround mode with the teams and the capabilities in place, it is also now starting to reflect in our order book and order backlog. I'm pretty sure the... Direction of travel is on its way. And like I said, in the next few quarters, you will start seeing strong lead indicators, you know, edging towards that kind of growth.

Okay, I understand. One last question, sorry. If I see the order book as because you have touched upon to that, after I think three or four quarters, we are seeing some good momentum building up there. So, I hope there is no change in the tenure of the deals that you are signing today and the order book that is getting visible to us. We'll convert into 12 months as we have seen in the past. Is there any change in the tenure of the deal that you were signing today as compared to what we used to do like three, four years back or three, four quarters back?

Yeah, you're right. So if you look at our total order backlog has grown faster than the 12 month backlog. So that's definitely there. What happens is, as we are trying to get into these AI-led initiatives, while we are offering the clients, you know, some discount and productivity efficiency, we are also trying to negotiate with them much longer contracts, so three-year, five-year kind of contracts, instead of the one-year renewals that we used to have earlier. So there is a change in the tenure of these deals that we have, and that's the reason the TCE has been moving much faster as compared to the 12-month backlog. But as you can see, our 12-month backlog is now catching up, and I'm sure we'll have a healthier backlog as we move as a 12-month backlog also. But in general, you are right. Your observation is right. The tenure of the order booking has definitely increased, and that's a very, very intentional plan. As we sign up for, you know, these productivity gains, we're also trying to sign up over a longer tenure so that we have enough time to, you know, ensure we deliver them profitably.

Understood. Thanks so much.

Thank you so much for taking my question.

Thank you, Devashish.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, you are requested to please limit yourselves to two questions per participant. You may rejoin the queue for follow-up questions. Our next question comes from the line of Ravi Menon from Macquarie. Please go ahead.

Hi, thank you for the opportunity. Yes, this is on the subcontracting cost. So, I see the other expenses for a second quarter we have actually seen this decline. So, has subcontracting come down this quarter?

Yes, Ravi, the subcontracting has come down in this quarter. Uh...

When you're talking about the U.S. and how you're starting to see a pipeline build up, do you think that as, at least in the initial phases, do you think subcontracting will be required and we could see this cost move up again and maybe have some pressure on margins near term until we hit some critical mass?

Yeah, yes. I mean, so what we're seeing is both kinds of deals. We're seeing deals which are regular and within the capability and capacity that we have between Oracle and Salesforce and those kinds of areas. Having said that, we are also gunning for some larger deals in newer areas that we don't necessarily have, you know, capacity for the U.S. today. And, uh, part of that fulfillment, uh, You know, we'll require some kind of subcontracting or partner arrangements that we have already worked out. So, yeah, as we look at getting into execution, some of these years initially may see higher subcontracting costs. Having said that, our endeavor on making sure that operational efficiency continues to be robust as well as we continue to drive, you know, AI-led productivity improvements is key to maintaining stable bottom line performance as we get into these AI-led and, you know, newer areas of business.

And once, you know, things settle down, I mean, you know, median terms are two or three years out and you have some sort of aspirational margin target or a band that you want to operate in.

Yeah, I think overall, like I mentioned earlier, we think around, you know, 16.5-17% EBITDA is a good, you know, position today. And I'm sure things will change. It's rapidly changing from an AI productivity possibilities. So what will happen over three years is hard to predict in terms of the degree of efficiency that it might bring. But from counter-investing and, you know, offering, sharing some of a portion of that benefits back to our clients as well as... Some of these capability expansions that we need to do using subcontractors and others that we will require to grow for the cost of sales. I think we feel comfortable in the 16.5%, 17% band.

One last question. We have heard one of your peers mention yesterday that they are starting to monetize their own IP that they've built for AI tools. Are you planning to do something like that that could enhance margins?

We actually have a very contrasting view to that. We do not want to get into the IP and the product business as far as AI is concerned. The ability to create and build and demonstrate that we are leaving it to the larger hyperscalers, and we would rather focus on the partnership model. I think our focus is executing services, and we will look at continued focus on service execution. So, we are not at all focused on building IPs as far as platform IP is concerned. Having said that, there will be a lot of IPs that will be created as you get into AI for business, which will be differentiated and really required for selling and as well as delivering the kind of efficiency that the client wants. We are looking at these IPs as our differentiators in winning as well as demonstrating success to our clients. I mean, IP monetization is not a focus area for us.

Thanks so much. Nice to meet you. Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Sushawan from Anandurati. Please go ahead. Hi. I hope my voice is audible.

Sir, you are audible. You may proceed. Yeah, just two sets of questions. One is, I think there was a mention, Deepak, about the fact that there is a one-time benefit of 149 pips on account of on-site leaves. If you could possibly explain further on that, that is one. And the second is, will this labor or the wage code impact, again, impact in Q4? How much would that be? And lastly, what would be the steady state tax rate? I think these were the two questions. So, I think this should be true, yeah. Did you state?

So on the first one, we at onsite, we have this leaf accumulation done by the employees. We saw people utilizing those leaves, and hence there was a reversal of the leaf provision which we made at onsite. That one-time benefit helped us negate the labor code impact what we had in our books. And there were other few small one-timers, which I would not want to call out, which is a very small from a maternity perspective. Going back to your second question, which is whether we are going to have impact of labor rate or labor code changes in Q4. As we speak, what we have done so far is we have taken a catch-up impact or a retrospective impact in our books. So we have gone conservative in our assumptions. However, there are a lot of rules and regulations which are still not very clear, and we are expecting a lot of clarifications in the next one or two months. And I think that is the problem which every IT company is facing. Once this clarification comes in, we will be able to estimate what the impact is going to be on our books, whether incremental expense rate or whether it's going to be a credit to our books. At this point in time, it is very difficult for me to make an assessment based on lacking those clarifications, like what will be the impact on Q4 Profitability. On the third part of the equation, on the tax rate, our effective tax rate is normally around 25-26 percent. We saw a decline in our effective tax in the current quarter for certain tax refunds which we got, which was basically related to some past years. We believe going forward, we will be still in the range of that 25-26%.

Thank you. And sorry, just on the on-site leave accumulation provision reversal, the impact is 150 bps. Is that fair?

No, that's not 150 bps. So, we had a labor code impact of 6.4 crores, which was almost 0.7% impact. The leave accumulation reversal is around 0.5-0.6%.

Okay, so 50-60 bps, right? That is fair, no?

Yeah, correct. 50-60 bps, yeah.

So, near term, it would be fair to assume that because if I take 15.5%, which was your last quarter, and this quarter, it is 16.1%. Assuming the labor code impact is 70 BIPs, then it becomes 16.8%. So, is it fair? And if I take this reversal of provision, it is 60 BIPs, so 16.2%. So, 16.2% EBITDA margin would be something that you would be comfortable with from a range perspective as an EBITDA margin. Is that fair?

So, Shobhan, we are looking at maintaining it between 16.5 to 17, like I said earlier. So, that's the range that we are comfortable with. We think we will be easily able to hold our grounds there. Okay. Thank you so much, Shobhan.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may press star and 1. Our next question comes from the line of Jalaj from Swann. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hope I'm audible.

You are audible as well. May proceed.

Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. Sir, I had one question with regards to the margins. I guess, sorry if I missed that, was there some one-time item or could you give us a margin walk on a sequential basis? Or later to this note?

Yeah, sure. So there was, we have improved our EBITDA by 60 basis points. Out of 60 basis points, 43 basis points is due to operational efficiency, which we have been driving for last few quarters, and 17 BPS basis points was because of forex tailwinds. We had a one-time impact of labor code wage, which was around 0.7% impact and amounting to 6.4 crores. That got negated by one-time credit, which we got because of leave accumulation reversal at on-site.

Okay, okay. So, they're matching. Basically, the one-time credit, labor card impact, and the leave investment, they're matching each other.

Yes, that's right, yeah.

Okay. So just building on to it, so you told that there will be further impact next quarter because of this labor code. So could you give us some ideas to what extent would it be? And secondly, I guess on a going basis, ongoing basis, this incremental change in definitions in both in gratitude and leaving cashmere should lead to a higher people cost going forward. So what sort of impact are you expecting because of this change in Liverpool?

Thank you for that question. So, on the first part, that in Q4, am I expecting an additional hit? There will be some true-up based on the clarification which we are going to receive from the Labor Department. Whether that is going to give me an incremental hit or whether it is going to give me a credit. At this point in time, it is very difficult to envisage that. So, we will have to just wait for those clarification to really reassess the impact we have taken. Having said that, what we have done from our side is we have gone a bit conservative on all our assumptions so that we don't see a significant or any incremental hit in our books in Q4. So we have taken the retrospective impact, we have gone, we have included all components of wage in the new wage definition, so that at least we are on the safer side of the things. So hopefully there should not be a significant impact in Q4 in terms of incremental expense, I mean, but let's wait for the clarification to come. On the second... On the second part of your question, which is on an ongoing basis, given that only 30% of our employees are at offshore, and most of our tenured employees are based on-site, we don't expect a significant impact on our books going forward. When we assess that impact, again, that is going to be, again, when you assess that, I mean, if you, I think it was around 150k, 200k per quarter. But again, when I'm saying that amount, I'm taking that with a pinch of salt because a lot of clarifications are pending, and based on that clarification, that amount can go slightly up or down. But at this point in time, we are only seeing an impact of 150k, 200k in terms of US dollars per quarter going forward.

Got it, got it. And my second part of question was for Umang. Umang specifically, and so I would want to have some discussion so you can throw some light on specifically on the US and both UK geographies. So, US, how far are we still from getting on to stability, both in terms of top line and profitability there? So, how far are we there? Second part is, on UK, do you believe the secured common business? I know you alluded to it that there is more, some benefits need to be passed down, but is it going to be a recurring thing? I mean, because it came in as a surprise, which had been in the last year also, as was highlighted by any other participants. So, what exactly are we seeing there, and how it should pan out going forward? Specifically on the secure side of business, because that's a larger part.

So, generally, as far as U.S. is concerned, like I mentioned earlier, we are a few, you know, maybe at least a couple of quarters away from starting to see the real ramp up. Like I said, we're taking care of some core fundamentals, both in terms of capability, leadership teams, our commercial offerings, GTM, etc. All of that is now in place. We're starting to see improvement in our pipeline as well as our order book numbers. And as we see... A couple of more quarters of healthy order book growth. I'm sure it will start reflecting on our revenue as well as the backlog numbers that we have to execute on. So that's as far as North America is concerned. Like I said, fundamentals are in place now. Already execution is underway. We had a healthy order book growth this quarter, and if we continue to run that momentum for the next few quarters, we'll be on a sustained growth train from there. As far as UK Europe is concerned, again, our capability in healthcare as well as public sector is extremely differentiated. The kind of work that we do is called critical national infrastructure kind of programs that requires, you know, experience, reference, as well as differentiated capability to execute. So, we feel very comfortable that the business that we have and that we are executing, you know, is secure and sustainable. We are also seeing a good, healthy demand in healthcare sector, which is potential for growing that business sustainably. Having said that, there is margin pressures on some of our accounts as the government expects to shift their budget into healthcare and reduce some of their spending in some of the other government departments, which we are negotiating and navigating with them.

Got it, got it. And on the US part, do you believe our reaching to a sizable amount or let's assume an inflection point there would take at least three, four quarters away or how far are we from that? And is it a function of, obviously macro should be a function of it, but it should be a function of macro, but our size is too small to macro actually starting to bother us there. So, how much more time do you feel like it should start to, we should see an infection point or a check of this?

I don't have a firm time commitment here, but I think next year would be the year when you start seeing US starting to improve sustainably in our business. I agree with you. The size of our business is. is not big enough to have a, you know, significant macro impact. However, what happens is sometimes the macro impacts one or two key customers of ours, and then it trades down to us. But what we are also trying to build is make sure that we have enough base and growth, both in our existing as well as net new customers, so that, you know, these impact of one or two clients that have earlier troubled us does not become a factor derailing our growth.

Understood. Understood. Thanks a lot and best of luck.

Thank you, Jalaj.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may please press star and one. Our next question is from the line of Sushawan from Anand Rati. Please go ahead.

Sorry, just one more follow-up question. So, just wanted to understand, at least from an outlook for this coming quarter view 4, what's your view there? Do you expect growth to come back strongly across all geographies, or is it specifically the UK that is going to come back strongly? If you could just provide some flavor on that, please.

So, Shubhan, as you know, we don't give any, you know, prediction numbers on our future performance, especially the near quarter numbers. But in general, we feel comfortable that, you know, the direction of travel, both from top line as well as bottom line, you know, should improve from where we were in Q3.

And a question for people, I just want to understand some subcon cost perspective as a percentage of revenues. How has it moved from last quarter to this quarter? Because what we also understand is the secure government services, I think that there may have been some ramdowns that would have possibly benefited the margins if you could provide some flavor on that aspect.

Thank you, Sushant, for that question. You are right. We did see some benefits from the reduction of subcontractors. In fact, it dropped by almost 0.7%. The subcontractor cost has dropped by 0.7% quarter and quarter. Again, it is on the back of the project, as you already mentioned.

Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Jalaj from Swann. Please go ahead.

Thanks. I have a follow-up question. Specifically, among as you see things today, would it be a fair assumption that the F27 should be a better year in terms of growth? So then F26, because at least on a UK, you would, as you have communicated, things should settle down or whatever the benefits should be passed on. And at least on an order 12 month, order backlog, that should, is that giving us enough confidence on that front? So there are things that need to be falling in place much more after this, beyond this also.

No, you're right. I think, like I mentioned earlier, this has been a year of fixing some of our core fundamentals, both from capability, domain, people, leadership point of view. I feel comfortable that we are more or less there in terms of whatever core fundamental changes that we had to deliver. As we go forward into FY27, we are expecting FY27 to be a stronger year as compared to FY26. Having said that, it's also some of those other Ds that we're looking at. The AI-led impact is also a lot about demonstrating benefit in your estate here and now, and then using that benefit to further find larger volumes of business. So, there might be a degree of, you know, impact on that count. But in general, we feel especially our U.S., India, and business growing, and U.K. continuing to be steady.

I understand. Thank you.

Thank you. We have no further questions, ladies and gentlemen. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Over to you, Seth. Thank you, Pratek.

So, thank you for asking all your questions. As I said, I think it's been a quarter of really focusing on fundamental improvements. We continue to focus on creating some differentiated core fundamentals across our capabilities and the verticals. Our view on key verticals like healthcare and life sciences, as well as public sector and financial services. It's getting strong. We believe there's good uptake and demand, especially in healthcare and life sciences, which is a core fundamental focus area for us. And with a strong leadership team now in place, I believe that we are moving towards the right direction and should see some strong positive impact as we go forward. Thank you, everyone. Thanks for participating and asking all your questions.

Thank you, everyone.

Thank you. On behalf of MassTech Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you all for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.