Max India Limited (MAXIND) Q1 2027 Earnings Call Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q1F527 Earnings Conference Call hosted by Max India Ltd. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference has been recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Rajesh Mehta, MD and CEO from Max India Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you. Namaste, everybody. Very good morning to all of you. On behalf of Max and They Are Limited, we extend a very warm welcome to all of you for the Q1 FY27 Earnings Call. Sincerely, thank you for your continued support, your trust, your confidence, which keeps us encouraging to undertake this journey in a very fast-evolving sector. Really appreciate your time for joining us today. And let me share a few updates. Before that, I have with me my colleague Dishan Khanna, who is the CEO for Antara Citric Care Services. Ajay Agarwal, deputy CEO, CFO, Antara Senior Living and Head of Investor Relations. Sandeep Pathak, who's the CFO for Max India and also the legal counsel for Max Group. Ankit, who's the CFO for Antara Assistant, Kerala Bishik Singh, who's part of our IR team, and Dev Raj from SGA and Rahul as well, who are IR advisors. We applauded the deck yesterday, so hopefully all of you have had a chance to go through it. I think if I start with what happened in the last quarter, it's been just execution, execution, execution. We've been focused on executing, and therefore, you're able to see now green shoes in all parts of the region. I would like to inform you that after a long, long wait, we have now issued offer of possessions to all our 340 residents in Anthara and Noida in the month of June 2026. This is something we have been waiting for. This is a very important milestone in Anthara's journey. We'll be operationalizing the first community in NCR. While we have many, many learnings from Dehradun, this is going to be quite different for us as well. 340 units, 200, 300 people moving in the next 30 to 45 days is going to be a vibrant and buzzing community. We raised a demand of about 169 cross with the offers of possession. Thirty-odd crores were collected within June, but the rest has now come, you know, most of it in July and August. As on date, approximately 75% of total dues have been collected. The rest are becoming due now, and we should be able to collect them as well. We have started to, you know, already put the team together. There are some people we have seconded from Dehradun to make sure the learning and the culture of Dehradun, you know, also permeates into Noida, and we'll be ready to welcome the residents, you know, in a few weeks from now. After that, the focus will now shift to saying that can we go ahead and get the approval for phase two, which is where we realize most of our profits, just to remind you. While the average prices at which we sold Noida was between 7,000 to 10,000, the last sale being 11,000 or so, the rates have moved significantly up, and they are in the range of 16,000, 18,000 plus. So hopefully when we launch phase two, we should be able to realize the profits as well. We continue to focus on growth of other geographies. I know some of you will be waiting impatiently saying, why haven't we announced more growth? But we are in the last stages of diligence for a wonderful opportunity in Bangalore. It's about, you know, about 300 odd units. It's in North Bangalore, 25 minutes from the airport in Devanhali, overlooking Vinamdi Hills at the back. Potential realization about 900 crores in terms of sales value. We are in the last stage of diligence now with the developer, so let's see how that goes. Also, aggressively working on a beautiful opportunity in Zehradun. We have had a long waiting list. We don't have inventory to sell. We have found a small piece of land. It might be just, you know, less than 150 units, but given the sales price we are commanding, the sales value will be again 850 to 900 crores. So if you look at our 1.5 million square feet ambition, about 1800 crores of value, that we should be able to achieve with these two, but we are still working on some more geographies as well, but these two are very specific, so I thought I'll mention them to you. We are also in dialogue with people in Chennai, Chandigarh and Lucknow, whereas these two will help us meet the commitment for this year. And obviously we'll provide disclosure and more detail once we execute the definitive documents. The expansion in assisted care is exactly as per plan. The occupancy in 485 beds is gradually increasing and is giving us confidence to explore further expansion sometime later part of the year. Age easy is also growing steadily. Whatever teething issues we have faced with our D2C channel or marketplace is now behind us. And I will share some numbers. The efforts are to make sure we are able to manage the inventory days given the current geopolitical situation. That is something that has come under pressure because of logistics costs and the ships not being available to bring the material from China. But that is something we are focusing on and deploying capital very prudently. We are very clear in our focus in terms of scalability and achieving profitability and demonstrating cost to profitability. And I will share some numbers as I go forward to substantiate what I am saying. If you look at the console numbers, the revenue grew. Q1F527 stood at 68.6 crores compared to 41.3 crores in Q1F526, representing a Y-on-Y growth of 66%. On a sequential basis, revenues marginally declined, primarily due to the lumpy, you know, where the DM income comes to us. The EBITDA loss for Q1F527 should have 25 crores compared to 23.2 in Q1F526 and 6.8 in Q426, while revenue saw decline in the agency due to cyclical, you know, impact. The profitable decline was primarily due to the impact of the exceptional DMPs received in the previous quarter, reflecting the plumpy nature of this revenue. If I give you some numbers for comparison, if I look at FI 25, 25, 24, and 26, the revenue on consult basis was 175 in 24, 145 in 25, and 119 in 26, so revenue grew. The EBITDA was 57 in FY24, 139 in FY25, and 121 in FY26. The reason between 24 and 25 was basically we put up 250 beds and also launched AGC. But as you can see now, as the revenue is increasing, the EBITDA losses are now coming down. So this is a demonstration of our commitment to work towards profitability. As of June 30th, 2026, the Treasury assets in Max India level stood at about 21 crores, with a conserved net worth of 372 crores. Now, coming to residences, starting with Dehradun, the operations continue to be profitable. We continue to focus on deeper engagement with our residents, cost optimization and profitability. Operating revenue was 6.2 crores in Q1 FY27, which is 1.1 times YNY basis. Marginally down by 7 lakhs, primarily due to club membership. These are all cyclical things will catch up. But our operations profit was a shift better, 0.92, which is up 2.3 times, Y and Y and 1.2 times Q on Q, given by continued cost optimization. There were four units which were released, which gave us additional revenue approximately 1.9 cross as marketing fee. And the community is now fully occupied, quite stable. Therefore, the growth will be linear in the future. Coming to Gurgaon, which was the first intergenerational project in Gurgaon Estate 360 developed by Max Estate, fully sold out. Collection continues to be strong, 22.5 crores, taking the ITD collection to 556 crores with a collection efficiency of 87% from inception to June 26. And Antara has earned 47.69 crores of management fee till 30th June 26th, out of which 3 crores have accrued in the current quarter. The second integration project, 361, which we only launched, if you recall, in December, total 360 units. We launched 180 first and then 180 in June. As of June end, the bookings were 154. So April, May, June, the market was sluggish given the geopolitical situation, but it is now caught up. So while we sold only 27 units in Q1 FY27, in the month of July alone, we sold about 34 units, and a similar trend continues in August. So we have caught up. The market is, you know, getting back to a little bit of normalcy, and therefore the sales velocity has not totally caught up on that side. Total collection is 108.2 crores since inception. So about 194, 197 units, you know, sold so far. On the Antara Assisted Care side, total bed capacity of 485 beds across 8 care homes in NCR, Bangalore, and Chennai. We have now completed and relaunched the DLF Phase 2 Gurgaon Centre in July 26, and all the 8 centres are now operational. Happy to report that 5 out of the 8 care homes are trending as per the operating model, and we are confident that others will also follow that trend. And we continue to watch this progress very carefully. The care home and services revenues were 12.03 crores, up by 1.5x, Y&Y, and 1.1x in Q&Q. The care home's revenue on a standalone basis was 1.3x in Q&Q. And the OBDs, the occupied bed days, went up by 23% on a Q&Q basis. Many care homes, as I said, are showing very good trends. Occupancy, Bannergatta, Bangalore, 41% in Q1, FY27, up from 37% in Q4, FY26. Guru Gram, 41% from 33% in Q4, FY26. Whitefield, Bangalore, 18% from 8%. And Omar, Chennai, 12% versus 3% for the same period. So you can now see how the occupancy is increasing across the care homes. Our care homes and services have now served about 2,700 patients during Q1 FY27 and about 53,000 patients inception. Revenue in the segment rose to 12.03 crores, which is 1.5 as I said earlier on YN1 basis and 1.1 on Q1 Q basis. The voice of customer was steady 84% in Q1 FY27 remained stable in July as well, reflecting the consistent quality of care and service we are delivering. Happy to also report that four of our care homes achieved an ever-highest RPOP, which is average revenue per occupied bed day, of 7,000 rupees plus in June 2026. This is really a testimony that the customers are appreciating our quality sales at a higher cost. Three of the four care homes have shown significant improvement in contribution margins, which now reflects the past profitability. On AGZ, we received a net revenue of 19 crores in Q1 FY27, showing a 1.3x Y&Y growth. It was lower than Q1 Q of 23 crores, driven basically by moderation of demand beyond the Q4 peak demand period. As all of us know, March quarter is always high from a revenue perspective to cover the annual targets, but some of this will get caught up as we go on in the year. The ARR now is trending towards 120, and a monthly run rate of about 10 crores in July, with marketplaces 6 crores, so the ROAS of 3.8, and at D2C, the exit ROAS of 2.6, so as you can see from the numbers, that now we are catching up on the ROAS as well. The offline channel achieved its highest ever revenue of 5 crores. Growing 18% Q1Q basis, a very good response to the newly launched product Commode Wheelchair. The overall ROAD, which is return on ad spend in Q1F527 exit, has improved to 2 versus 1.8 in Q4, marking a 10% growth. The stat index in Q1F527 is 82%. ADZ now has 112 products launched till date, out of which 86 are currently live. We are now also present on QuickCommerce, which is Blinkit and Zepto. Our diaper category, which was the new unique diaper that we had launched, which we have a patent on. Now we are hitting a 1,500 pack sale per day,

which is really, sorry,

a 6x growth in market share on Amazon over the last 60 days. As you know, this is a unique product. It is the only adult diaper with the smart absorption technology, and now it is showing up in our increasing market chain as well. Four patents have been granted to us for products, and there are three patents which have been filed for senior specific innovative products, reflecting our commitment to innovation. And this really will be the biggest differentiator in the mode that we will have. The more patents we have, the more stronger our products will be differentiated. AGZ so far has touched about 9 lakh lives with about 88,000 repeat customers, and serves in reception, achieved an NPS of about 60, which is quite high, but that reflects improving customer stickiness as your usage deepens over time. Gross margins for online channels, such as D2C and marketplaces, maintained at 45% in Q1 versus 46%, despite very challenging geopolitical situations, which have pushed up the cogs for each product. From this quarter, we are over-indexing on brand awareness. We have onboarded Anupam Care as a brand ambassador. And therefore, we did spend some money, which we'll see as an expense, you know, in the financial submitted to you. But we are seeing the payback as well. In the month of July, the ARR has now picked up to about 10 crores. Our conversion rates have improved from 2 to 3.5, and our ROAS has gone up as well. So the brand spend that we did is already showing the payback in the month of July itself. If I was to really, you know, consolidate, you know, ASCS and look at Q1 last year, Q4 and Q1 this year, the revenue was 21, 32 and 30 respectively. With EBITDA losses at 14, 18.5 and 19. So despite the brand spend, despite the cost of goods going up, we've been able to bring down the EBITDA losses or keep them flat with revenue, you know, going up quarter on quarter. The last update I'd like to give you is on the Antara Integrated Wellness Clinic. As you know, this is our key differentiator for residences. We had launched a pilot in Gurgaon in our care home to see what is the impact and what is the receptivity of customers. This is a wellness clinic anchored around modern medicine, but combines modalities of Ayurveda, ozone therapy, infrared sauna, nutrition, etc. Financially, the net revenue for Q1 F527 was 15.75 lakhs. This is expected at this stage to be a negative contribution margin in the first quarter only, but we should be able to cover it up as we go forward. On the customer sat score, very high satisfaction, 96%, with average revenue per client of 4,000. The footfalls have grown steadily from 199 sessions to 307 sessions in June. It's a rapid increase. And therefore, we'll now focus on spending some marketing money and scaling up this, and also making sure we launch this in Antara Noida as residents start checking in. On the partnership front, we continue to work with Star Union and IIT Life Insurance to integrate senior wellness with financial literacy, culminating in specialized financial products for seniors, and with IIT Delhi on mobility products and well-being nutrition on nutraceuticals and supplements, and SWASA on self-diagnosis for lung health. Our brand continues to gain strong recognition. The Antara Senior Care is receiving the Visionary Leadership in Senior Living Award at the HD India Real Estate Expo in June 26. Honoring our contribution to India's silver economy. We also concluded the NABH accreditation in Vanagatta, which is quite essential for TPN insurance. And we have gone through some more inspection for NABH and the other care homes. So in summary, Q1 FI 27 has been full of action and execution. We remain confident in our underlying trajectory backed by successful handover of possession at Antara Noida. Steady sales momentum in Gurgaonau, and improving occupancy trends in care homes, and early signs of recovery in the AGZ ROAS. As we look ahead, we remain committed to profitability. As we said, AGZ perhaps, you know, by January or last quarter this year, will be in that zone. And we'll continue to contain losses even though we scale up care homes to make sure we're committed to our path to profitability. So I'll stop here and welcome any questions that you might have. And thank you once again for joining the call.

Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and 1 on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. We take the first question from the line of Harsh from Ionis Alpha. Please proceed.

Yeah, hi. Hi, Rajat and Dean. A couple of questions from my end. Firstly, a broader question. You know, I just wanted to double click on the EBITDA, you know, breakeven by the end of the financial year target. If we could just, you know, understand, particularly from the cost angle, what should change, you know, in this quarter versus, say, Q4 of, you know, this financial year, and even, you know, from a top-line basis, where should one look at? I understand the... You know, Reggie business can be quite lumpy, but just talking about AGZ and care homes, what should that look at, broadly speaking, by the end of the financial year? Secondly, on the care homes part, just wanted to understand, you know, your thought process as to where do we stand now versus, you know, what was the initial plan, especially on the occupancy levels? The reason why I'm asking this is that, you know, is there any plans to start adding BEDs in the near future? Have we reached that inflection point?

Yeah. So, I cannot comment on specific numbers of F527 in the future, but when I made the comment on profitability, I meant on AGZ, which is our commitment. That is one. KROs, obviously, since we built out the bed in the last few months, they will have to wait out the 8-10 quarters it takes for the bed to be profitable, you know, at a unit level. ASL will continue to be lumpy, so when we get the DMP and etc., it will show as a bit of, you know, positive, right? But that varies depending on the projects we sign and DMP, right? But to your question, you know, I will repeat the numbers, you know, once again, so that you are able to see what I am saying. If you look at our overall console basis, the revenue has steadily gone up from 175 to 145 to 190 over the last three years. The EBITDA losses were 57, went up to 139 because we added 250 beds, launched ADZ in that year, and then brought 139 down to 121, despite the revenue going up. This trajectory will continue for FY27 in terms of revenue going up substantially and the beta loss is getting contained because now we are not adding any new beds at this point of time. AGZ will continue to throw better contribution margin. So as we go in the next and next quarter, you'll find the trajectory to be substantiated. Occupancy, as I said, the OBD beds have gone up by 23%, but if you look at respective, you know, So, five of the eight care homes are now trending to the model that we have shared with all of you, respectively. Five of them, right? The rest is work to do as we go along. But now we are confident. So sometimes the infection point, if you recall, was October, November. We had said we'll wait till that time and then start making the call on expansion. So we are sticking to that timeline. No changes in that, you know, as well.

Just to add, Harsh, on AgeEasy, what are the metrics that you would look at and how that will move to profitability is your CM2. If you see, historically, we've reported minus 80, minus 70 percent CM2s for AgeEasy. As of July, the marketplaces CM2 came down to minus 17 percent, 1.7 percent, and this number for all other channels will continue to improve at the back of improving return on advertising spend, which doesn't work. And this will be corresponding to better gross margins and higher top-line. So that is how the CN2 will keep improving to achieving a break-even till Q4.

Some of the aberration you see in, for example, employee expenses, right, is basically some provisions getting written back. So each year we provide for variable pay, but when we payout in the month of May, for Q4 the provisions get, you know, trued up. But once we start Q1, we again start providing. So it's just an accounting thing in terms of provisions, nothing else.

Understood. Just on the blended RPOP bit in care homes, I understand that the last few bed additions or substantial bed additions were at a higher RPOP. So RPOP should be between a blended RPOP, you know, once the occupancy rises, should be between 6,500 to 7,000? Is that the right way to look at it?

It should be near 7,500.

Okay. Thank you.

Thank you, Ash.

Thank you. Before we proceed, a reminder to the participants, in order to ask a question, you may press star and one on your touchstone telephone. We take the next question from the line of Nikhil Gupta from YU Capital. Please proceed.

Good morning. Thank you for the opportunity. My first question is a bookkeeping question on senior living. So out of the 33 odd crores collection we did from the Noida community, what would be the revenue which would have been attributed to the Q1?

So, one, the revenue in the NOIDA will be booked at the STV level, and since it's a joint venture with us, we will be only consolidating the net P&L. Now, as regards to the joint venture company, if I are asking about the revenue recognition there, presently in June, there had been no revenue recognition because the revenue recognition is not linked with collection, it is linked with the possession or registration. So, the possessions are going to happen in Q2, and that's the year when all the revenue recommendations and inventory titles will take place.

Thank you Ajay for that answer, but somehow I'm not able to reconcile the number. So let's say, so you have mentioned in the investor deck, the odd 38 crore from that senior living segment. I believe around 8 crore is the treasury income and 30 is our core operation. So around 6 is Dehradun, 3 and 4 is from our Gurgaon communities. I'm not able to add that 30 number. Can you please help me with that?

Sorry, from where are you seeing this number? From the results? So, from the results or from the investor day? Residences have three components of income, sir. One is the DMP's income, what we are getting at Antara Senior. Second is the Ops revenue, what I am getting at Antara Purukur. And third is the finance lease income, which I am getting as a re-lease in Antara Purukur. That amount was approximately 15 crores for the quarter. I think that's the gap what you are mentioning at that point. Since it's not a regular income for me, it's always exceptional because we don't plan for a release. Hence, I don't explicitly display this into my gross revenues in my investor release. I just simply say how much release we have done and how much marketing fee I want.

Okay, so the DM fees is around 7 crores, operation is also around 6-7 crores, and the finance fees is 15.

Correct.

And what would be the then odd 8 crores that would be the treasury income at the residency level?

Correct. Okay.

Can you help me explain, like, this finance lease? What is this income? Like, I'm not able to understand this.

So, basically, our Amtara Purukul is on a lease model, wherein if any units get resold, so if somebody is exiting because of debt or they are shifting from Deradun and they want to sell their property, it has to be re-leased. So they have to surrender their lease to the company and the company have to release it again. So as per accounting standards, the remaining lease period, I have to recognize as a revenue. And against that, I recognize the cost of lease premium. And in that particular transaction, we earn some bit of a marketing fee that I account for as an additional revenue in our other income.

Got it. My next question is on our integrated wellness. So going forward three to five years, do you see this segment growing significant, contributing significant to our panel? Because in the annual report also, I think we are, we have mentioned this category as a separate segment. So, is it, can you provide more color that do we think that it can contribute significantly going forward next three to five years?

Actually, the AIWC is an integral part of our residences. We are not opening a separate business line where we will launch AIWC clinics. We will simply put them in all the residences so that it's a strong differentiator, very difficult to replicate. It's not just about a doctor or nurse sitting in the campus. It's about a full-fledged protocol-based integrated medicine system which we are launching in the residences. And therefore, All the revenues which come from there, right, difficult to predict at this point of time, but given the volume of people we are handling, let's say 340 people units in NOIDA phase 1, means about 600 people, right, difficult for me to comment, you know, how much revenue we will get, but it's a strong differentiator. We will also try to put them in the care homes to be able to work as OPDs to attract, you know, footfalls. Right. So that's the intention really. We are not launching a standalone clinics.

Right, well understood. The last question is on AGZ. I think somehow the growth has been slow, but sometimes that happens, that's fine. I think we projected to almost double our revenue from 77 to 150 odd growth. So do you still see that happening? Because somehow we are still at the 18-0-1 revenue seems very, very low. Some thoughts, some thoughts please on that.

Hi, Ishan here. Yes, we are still very much on our plan for doubling this year. If you see the year on year growth, it is still significantly high. Yes, quarter on quarter, there has been moderation. But if you look at July numbers, which Rajit quoted, we are already at a 120 crore annual revenue rate with a 10 crore closing number for the month of July, which is not only an improvement in the top line, but is also complemented with a significant improvement in return on advertising spends. Which is what we were working on in quarter 1 to solve so that the next three quarters of growth is at the back of a strong base, both in terms of our CM2s and our ROAS. So Q2 to Q4, we will see a significant improvement in the top line as we have already demonstrated that we can efficiently do it by doing the ROAS.

Thank you for the response. That's it for myself. Best of luck. Thank you.

Thank you. Before we proceed, a reminder to the participants. In order to ask a question, you may press star and one on your touchtone telephone. We take the next question from the line of Rano Deep from MAS Capital. Please proceed.

Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. My question is around AGV. Now, AGV's revenue has declined 18% QoQ after the Q4 peak. Now, how much of Q4 was genuinely seasonal versus demand pulled forward through promotions? And what should investors consider, you know, the normalized quarterly revenue base going forward? And a connected part to the team, ages, is like we've touched nine likes, lives till date, but only 88,000 are repeat customers. So, how do you distinguish between top-line growth purchase through marketing and genuine customer loyalty? And, you know, and the last part of that question is, what repeat rate and CAC to LTV ratio would convince you that AGG has become a structurally strong consumer brand?

Sure. So, I'll let Ishan answer that, but to your question on quarter-on-quarter, there was a transition that we were doing, you know, in Q4 last year.

I think one has to be cognizant of a couple of things in a business like AGV, which is a product business, is that one, there will be two impacts that we will see on how this plays through the year. One is that around the festive period, which is depending when it happens September, October, we will see a significant surge, which we saw last year as well. Q3 was a significantly higher number compared to Q2. Or September, October was the peak. We will see that same peak this year as well. And the second seasonality impact that comes, which does come for products like kneecaps, nebulizers, diapers, is during the winter season, where the consumption is higher. So, going forward also, I would want to indicate that we will see these, it will not be linear. We will have these spurts during periods of either high purchase during the festive time and then in the winter season. What also happens towards the latter half of the year is that we do, and because we work with marketplaces, there are some... You know, big deals, the purchases that they make from us because it's everybody's year end and closing. So that also happens. And hence you see that kind of an impact. Will we see that this year? Yes, we will see that kind of seasonality impact and persevere impact this year as well. Like I also mentioned that July and August, we are already seeing that it is going back to 120 and now 140, 150 crore ARR as well. So that trajectory is picking up, giving us the confidence that the guidance we have for this year's revenue for HEDG should certainly happen.

And on the CAC to HEDG ratio?

We will currently be looking at return on advertising spend. So, the return on advertising spend is a critical factor because that currently tells us the efficiency that the brand is giving us and how our performance marketing is efficiently moving. We were at, if you recall in the last quarters, we were at around 1, 1.5 for our D2C and we were at around 2, 2.5 for marketplaces, which is now closer to 4 for marketplaces and 2.5 for D2C. Now, that efficiency indicates because marketing is the biggest spend in D2C, in ADD. So that return on advertising spend is a critical factor. And on your repeat, I want to clarify one thing that our repeats are not 18,000. Our repeats are around 88 to 90,000. That's the number. We are at around 10 to 12% repeat rate. One has to also understand the nature of products we sell. Besides diapers, which is one of our top-selling products, the others don't lend themselves to repeat. So somebody who's bought from us one product will at best buy some other product. And chances of buying the same product, like if you bought a VP monitor, you will probably come back and buy a VP monitor from me maybe after a year or two. So same product repeats. The cross-tell is where the opportunity is, and that's what now we're building an engine to promote and push.

But directionally, if you're able to achieve a 20% plus repeat rate, we should be in good, good space.

Sure, sure. Thanks for the clarification. Rajita, my next question is more of a macro question unto you. So MaxIndia's long-term thesis appears to be built around India's aging population and the emergence of large silver economy, which you've explained beautifully in the past. But given the significant capital requirement to build communities, care homes, and consumer products, what prevents a large hospital chain or a real estate developer or a financial services player from eventually entering senior care and compressing your returns? What is the moat you believe will still exist 10 years from now?

Yeah, so let's talk about a segment separately, right? And by the way, please keep in mind when we are saying we are building an integrated care ecosystem, we are focusing on the consumer. It's the same consumer who depending on age, medical condition and circumstances will need either a residence or a rehab or a diaper or a wheelchair. So we've taken a customer view, number one. Number two, if you look at all the three segments. Real estate players have come and replicate the infrastructure, no doubt on that, and maybe do a better job. However, the core of that product is services, not infrastructure. It is all the IP we have gained over the years in terms of what kind of engagement services, what kind of wellness services. To integrate what kind of, you know, mental wellness, emotional, social, etc. we'll have to, you know, offer all the practices that we have picked up in terms of, you know, how to handle muscle loss, failure, anxiety, depression, and now our ability to put integrated medicine inside, which is more IP based, you know, it's not just you hire a doctor and start doing that, which is going to be a strong differentiator. Most real estate developers, if you follow the trend, are outsourcing this. Either they are tying up with a nearby nursing home or tying up with a hospital. That's not a sustainable model. You need a doctor to stay on the campus. You need a first responder team for emergencies. You need nurses 24 by 7, so on and so forth. So on that, our most is going to be our entire IP around wellness services that we have developed, which we will now keep on strengthening as we go along. That's on that. On the care home side, frankly, there are some hospitals, chains who are doing geriatric care now wanting to do care homes. The simple answer I have is if I was an investor, since I come from the healthcare world, I'll prefer to spend 100 rupees on the healthcare business that generates a bit of 30% plus versus the 18% margin. The care homes are more a hospitality with some medical care kind of business while the hospitals are more surgery, diagnostic and pharmacy business. So while they, you know, in a summary sense, somewhere appears similar, the profit signatures and the competencies are very different. So if a hospital decides to come into the care homes, frankly, the investor should ask the question, why the hell are you diluting your margins? Why are you spending your time and money? Either you say that you are running your hospitals totally full, you can't open more beds, and all the flow over you want to capture. If you look at the care at home journey as well, many people are offering at home services, but they are only offering to the captive patients. They are not able to market and find profitability. So that's my answer to the second question. On AGC, there are only two modes. This is differentiated, innovated products which are seen as specific and brand. Nothing else is a moat, right? So therefore, the patents we are filing, we already have, you know, three patents, three BFI. The more we learn about, you know, consumer behavior and the bigger brand we build is what is going to stand us, you know, in good stead. The market, by the way, individually for the process is quite large. If you look at the diaper market itself, it's about 2,000, 2,500 crores, kind of market, 5,000 crores. Only, right? So we're not building a 10,000 crore business in AGZ in the next five years. It's going to be perhaps 1,000 crores. So enough market to be had on that side. That's my answer to the verticals.

Appreciate the response, sir. Only just from a, I think we raised it last time also, I think, with respect to the announcement about expansion, if we can be a little more aggressive, given in the past you've seen a couple of cities being on pause or halted, so we eagerly look forward to the announcement, and I think you gave a glimpse about the Bangalore opportunity that you spoke, so look forward to that, yeah.

Absolutely. I'm quite unfortunate we had to unwind Chandigarh because after operations endured, the height clearances were not given to communities on the flight path. In Bangalore, unfortunately, the developer ran into some financial issues, but totally appreciate that comment. Quite focused, and in the next few months, we'll find the announcements coming through. Thank you.

Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajveer Singh from Vivek Investment Managers. Please proceed.

Thanks for the opportunity. My question is that among the residential, senior living, care homes, care at home, and CAGV, which business do you believe can ultimately generate the highest return on capital? And where do you intend to deploy the majority of incremental capital? That's not that question.

So by nature, if you look at the way we do our business, our senior living model is quite capital light because we don't buy land. We tie up with developer partners who own land and practically construct. So there we don't require that much of capital per project. It's very small. AGZ, we have already done the heavy lifting and the investments. So if you're able to meet our objective of F527 last quarter being contribution positive and beta positive, that will not require much capital. I think the capital that will be required will be care home expansion, for each bed takes about 10 to 12 lakhs per bed, including the ops losses. And therefore, that's going to be a business of scale. That is where most capital will go.

So, do you think the highest, that business is also going to generate the highest return on capital, I mean, if we had so much of capital there, instead of in the other area?

You see, if you look at, you're talking about Rossi, I presume, right? There, I feel, you know, AGC, obviously, the nature of the business is such as e-commerce is not leaner in growth, is, you know, it jumps in terms of, you know, the ARR. That is going to be the highest Rossi business, followed by K-ROMs. The ASL segment is quite IRR based, and there, our objective is to be able to build a very healthy annuity income. So, if we are able to achieve our target of 1,800 per sale value every year, we will be able to see a very healthy annual income in 30 and 33. So, the three businesses operate a little bit differently, but between AGZ and K-ROM, obviously, AGZ will have a much higher ROSI, but even the ROSI in K-ROM should be 23, 24 plus.

Understood. My second question is that despite strong revenue growth, the company is still reporting substantial losses. So can you give us a sense of the expected cash burn over FI27 and FI28 before the existing businesses become self-sustaining?

I can't share projections of FI27 and FI28 at this point of time. I only shared the past numbers with you. As I said, the EBITDA losses went up. From 57 to 139, then we built 250 beds, and we launched the agency business, but since then, the revenue has increased, and the EBITDA losses have come down, you know, from 95% to 63% this year, right, EBITDA loss. Significant drop suddenly, and this trajectory will continue in FY27. As we report next quarter, I promise you, you will see the reduction in 63 as well.

Thank you so much for answering the questions. Okay.

Thank you. A reminder to the participants, in order to ask a question, you may press star in 1 on your touchtone telephone. We take the next question from the line of Vikas. An individual investor, please proceed.

Hi, sir. Thanks for your time. Just wanted to understand, since we are making decent amount of losses still, and we have reached capital last year, and the cash is also limited on the balance sheet, how we look to sustain the business going forward, what kind of capital is in class we have?

So, we have, I mean, nothing has changed because from what you said, you know, a year back, two years back, in terms of how much capital we need. The first raise was done through two tranches of rights issue and the prep issue, and the balance was supposed to be raised as we went into business. That was supposed to be done June this year, but frankly, due to better performance and we taking some credit lines to manage the working capital, inventory, etc., we have been able to push. The fund, the second fund raise out, but the number hasn't changed. And we've also received 40 crores with the second branch of the press issue in July. What has changed really, this caused us to have a, you know, push the fund raise also is that the NOIDA possession, you know, opened up, and therefore those collections have come in, and we're able to utilize that. But the total number of capital required has not changed for the last two years. In fact, it's come down a shade. From a peak requirement, which we thought was about 25 million dollars, it's come down to about 20 or under 20 now.

Sir, so let's say for next two years, what is the incremental capital required, sir, as far as our thought process?

The estimate is around 20 million.

Okay. Thank you.

Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajveer Singh from Vivek Investment Managers. Please proceed.

Thanks for the follow-up. My question is regarding DLF announcing its entry into the senior living. So, I just wanted to know your thoughts about it. I mean, it's a big competition coming in.

Yes, surely. It's not only DLF, it's other also market investors wanting to look at senior living. DLF, our best understanding, they have delayed their launch consistently for the last six months now. They have an existing community in Gurgaon where they are putting one or two towers as senior living. It's not something that they are creating new. Within the existing township is what they want to do. And they are tied up with most probably Medanta Hospital for doing the healthcare services, how they are attempting it. We welcome the move actually, because all these people will spend marketing monies and create awareness, you know, for the customers, while the announcement made by DLFK six months back, we haven't noticed any impact on our sales velocity of Gurgaon. It is going as per plan for this year. We are exactly on the plan. But I think we are actually wanting more and more people to step in. A, it increases category awareness. B, it will also push the government to release minimum standards. Because the more standards that come in, some of us who are specialized in senior living will tend to benefit. So actually we are quite welcoming them all.

Yeah, I think as first, it should give us the first mover advantage as well. Yeah, it's already gone.

We haven't stopped our sales in 361, and as I said, the launch has been delayed twice now, so let's see when they launch.

All right. Sounds good. Thank you so much.

Thank you. As there are no further questions from the participants, I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.

So, thank you very much once again for joining. Again, deeply, deeply appreciate the questions. I think you are absolutely on the ball. These are questions you should be asking us, you know, on the path to profitability, on growth, and making appropriate announcements. We absolutely welcome these. Now, I'd like to assure you that whatever plan we had for this year, our currently on plan, there are some minor, you know, aberrations because of external factors will keep on happening. For example, the labor courts pushed up the manpower cost for the quarter. Now, we'll have to find ways and means of mitigating that. The geopolitical issue, you know, caused the logistics cost, you know, and delivery from China impacted. And we had to airlift some products which caused a marginal depression. But all these in the current world are things I think any business should just embrace and keep moving on. And that's what we're doing. We're just focused on execution. There is no new strategy we have to think through. We're very clear what we are doing and what we want to do. Hopefully, in the next two quarters, you will find more and more evidence from us. On our commitment to pass to profitability in all the businesses. There are different points of time, but at least the moment you should be able to see. That's our promise to all of you. So thank you once again, and wishing you a very, very happy 8-year Independence Day as well.

Thank you. On behalf of Max India Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.