Sandhar Technologies Limited (SANDHAR) Q4 2026 Earnings Call Transcript

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Sandaar Technologies Q4 F526 Earnings Conference Call, hosted by Dollard Capital Markets Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal the operator by pressing star, then zero on your touch-tone telephone. Please note, That this conference is being recorded. I will now hand the conference over to Ms. Shirley Jain from Dollop Capital Markets Private Limited for opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you.

Thank you, Ryan. Good morning, everyone. On behalf of Dollar Capital, I would like to welcome you all to the fourth quarter and FY26 earnings conference call of Sundar Technologies Limited. Today, we have with us from the management team, Mr. Jayan Dharwar, Executive Chairman and CEO, Mr. Neel Jay Dharwar, Director, Mr. Gurvinder Ji Seng, Whole Time Director and Head of Corporate Strategy, and Mr. Jayan Dharwar, Director. We will begin the call with opening comments from the management team, followed by their question-and-answer session. Over to you, Jen, sir.

All right. Thank you, Shelley. Thank you, all of Capital. And good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I welcome you all to the quarter, four, and 12-months earning con-call of Sanda Technologies Limited. I'm very happy and pleased to inform you that in line with the expectation, Sandhar has crossed the revenue mark of over 4,800 crores, which is an all-time high. The Indian auto industry recorded growth across all segments in the financial year 26, with domestic sales hitting a seven-year high, according to the data that's been published by Siam. The strong contributors obviously have been the positive sentiments, which was created through the GST2 reforms, and the multiple repo rate cuts during the year. At the same time, this year, in the latter part of the year, has seen what many people say has been a deterrent. With the world experiencing what the economists call a polycrisis, it's multiple cascading shocks running simultaneously. Whether it was the U.S.-China tariff architecture or the tariff load on India, whether it is the Middle East, which remains volatile. The European energy costs, which went up dramatically, also the commodity prices, which was so volatile that it skipped both sides by almost 20 to 30 percent. But despite all of this, India's GDP continued to grow, and we grew at over 6.5 percent. Passenger vehicles hit new records. Two-wheelers crossed the mark of what we had done in 18-19. And the automotive sector at almost 22 lakh crore in size is now the third largest in the world and growing very, very rapidly. Where Sandhar is concerned, if I was to compare Sandhar with the industry growth, especially the India business of Sandhar, the industry has achieved a growth rate of 12.7%, whereas Sandhar has achieved 28%. In terms of two-wheelers, Industry has achieved a growth rate of 12.9%, whereas Sandar has achieved 35.1%. So almost one-third revenue growth has come in the area of two-wheelers. In terms of our consolidated yearly performance, which is financially at 26 versus FI25, the revenue for 25-26 is 4852 crores, which is up 25% on a consolidated basis. EBITDA at 513 crores, higher by 28% year-on-year at the rate of 10.6%, double digits and more. PBT at 256 crores, up 39%, and PACT crew by 40% at 199 crores. The consolidated year performance, which is quarter four year on year, revenue up by 29%, EBITDA up by 33%, with the gross margin or EBITDA margin at 11%, PBT up by 42%. If I look at India business yearly performance, the revenue growth is up 28% at 4384 crores, EBITDA at 472 crores, higher by 32%, TBT at 282 crores, up 37%, TAT grew by 44% year-on-year to 221 crores. If I look at quarter four of India business, revenue up by 32%, EBITDA up also at 32%, EBITDA up by 37%. Coming to joint ventures, the performance of all five joint ventures has been satisfactory and registered revenue of 257 crores and an EBITDA of 28.25 crores. We are constantly watching the performance and are taking all necessary steps in collaboration with our joint venture partners for sustained growth and profitability. Currently, the investment of Sangha in the joint ventures is 62-odd crores. Overseas subsidiaries. In overseas subsidiaries, we sustained an annual loss of 2.56 million euros, which is 26.19 crores at EBD level. The best part, however, is that in quarter four, the business has turned around and registered an EBITDA of 14.6% and has come to neutral or break even at EBD level. We expect the improvement to continue further in view of the optimization efforts which are carried out there. Of course, with the recent increase in aluminum prices, we might find a little bit of a dip in quarter one, but once the regenerative cycle of the pass-through of aluminum prices comes through, we are back on track with our international or overseas subsidies. In terms of EV, the business finally is on track. I'm happy to share the EV business is gradually picking up and closed this year with a revenue of 20 crores. We are expecting now to double this revenue in the current financial year. During financial year 2026, 41,000 battery charges were sold and 5,500 motor control units were sold. Sandaar is on a growth path, and I would like to further reiterate that we expect to double our revenues every three to four years with consistent improvements in margins and return on investments. We are also very cautious about preserving our cash reserves and managing a healthy liquidity position to meet our commitments. We are expanding our footprint and carrying a sound relationship with all our esteemed customers. I am thankful to all investors who have shown faith and confidence in us and are continuing with us. I am also thankful to all the stakeholders for their continuous support and patronage. This particular year will be another very interesting year, and despite all the problems in the Bali crisis that I spoke about, I do expect that even on a conservative level, I'm happy to give a guidance of over a 15% growth in the overall revenue. This is, without taking, a price retrigger, which is likely to happen, especially with a lot of costs having gone up. A lot of states announcing new fan power costs, which has also been a challenge in the last few months. But we do expect with the repricing and recosting that is happening, gas prices going up, oil prices going up, manpower costs going up, which is affecting every aspect of input costs, there will be a pricing re-trigger mechanism that will be activated. And sometimes this becomes positive for the company because many costs or pricing that has been done by the customer was done years ago. And this gives us a mechanism to bring it to the current level of stability. So with that, I am very happy to close my opening comments, and we will be happy to take your questions. For anything to do with technology strategy, we have G.J. Singh. We have Yashpal Jain, our CFO, who will be very happy to answer your questions on financial matters. And I am, of course, there to complement and supplement whatever is necessary. With that, thank you very much. I'm happy to take your questions.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and 1 on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use their handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. If you wish to ask a question, please press star and 1. The first question from the line of Chiraz Jain from MK Global. Please go ahead.

Yeah, congratulations, Jain, sir, and the entire team, Sundar, for a very strong performance across the division. So my first question is in terms of revenue growth guidance, which you indicated that you plan to double your revenues over the next three to four years, which in a way implies about 20-25% annualized growth. Can you share more light in terms of which segment or customers or product categories is likely to be a major growth driver over here?

Thank you, Chirag, for that question. Like I said, we are very, very positive and optimistic on the growth of the automotive industry in India, and especially in the two-wheeler sector. As I said today, the entire industry, if it wasn't for the manpower constraints that most of the industry is facing, we would be... We're probably growing at a faster level than we are doing right now. This, of course, is the entire automotive industry. So even if I was to produce more and the others don't, competence applies. Obviously, the entire thing doesn't match up. But the demand is extremely, extremely positive, very, very strong. And I think in the two-wheeler segment, for example, there are now three leaders who are fighting bitterly amongst each other to become number one. Having said that, um... We, as a company, continue to get very, very robust orders in some of the new businesses that we have, whether it is sheet metal, whether it is casting. But now, with new technologies being thrown in, we do believe that the speed of growth of even the business that we have in our proprietary business, the locks, the mirrors, and so on and so forth, are getting a major fillip. So, in terms of customers, all customers, like I said, are very, very positive and very demanding for this year. You'll, of course, have to wait and see, and therefore, that's the reason why I'm giving you a conservative estimate. Of 15% plus, 15 to 16% plus of revenue growth this year, this, of course, doesn't include the pricing re-trigger that I spoke about, which will bring additional revenue to the company.

Understood, sir. Thank you. And on the new businesses or the new projects, on the existing one, we are close to doing about 12% EBITDA margins, and now we have crossed even 20% ROC threshold. How do we see the new projects, let's say, moving towards the direction of our existing or mature businesses, both in terms of, let's say, the overall revenue potential? We have done about close to 340 crores of investment. So, what kind of revenue potential we could have? And maybe on the profitability front, I mean, when we can achieve, let's say, sort of close to double-digit margins that we are doing on the existing business? If you can share some thoughts over there.

So, as we said today, I think Yashpalji will answer that question as to how many units are still in losses, which will become positive in this year. But on an overall platform, all I want to say is that you are aware that we've made a lot of investments in new businesses in the last few years. Which include the acquisition of Sundaram Clayton Aluminium business, which include the new business of sheet metal, which was then taken in terms of order booking. All those businesses are now mature and are throwing very, very positive results. We only expect that with new additions, now those capital expenditures have already been done to a large extent in these businesses. We do expect that all of them will start showing results, but the positive news is that when we had taken these businesses, there was an anticipation of the amount of growth that these businesses would be able to show. I'm happy to say that that level of growth is not only being validated, but is being exceeded by a large degree and a percentage to what we are anticipating.

Do you want to come in and talk about the loss-making units, where we are?

Sure, sir. So like as we have mentioned on page 7 also of our industrial presentation, one of the loss-making units is Sundar's business that we have acquired in March 25. And the shifting is in progress, and I think by the end of Q2, we will be able to shift the entire business to our own premises. I think from Q3 onwards, we would start a turnaround in the units with our new EBT levels. But on a yearly basis, 26-27, we expect to continue with EBT level losses in this die-casting business that we acquired from Sundam Ketan. There is another project in Khed City for aluminium die casting, which is focused on passenger vehicle segment. From quarter 2 onwards, it will start generating EBT level margins. So this is a turnaround time for this project. There is another project in Pune, cabins and fabrication, that also we expect to start turnaround from the end of quarter 2 of this current financial year. And then EV business, we expect to turn around in profitability in FY28, means the next financial year. This year, we expect the revenues to approximately double, but there would be losses again as we are trying to develop more new products also and capturing new markets. So that involves some cost. And Romania also, FY28, we are expecting to go at a break-even or I would say in a profitability mode. So this is how the timelines as the management expects as I visit on today's time.

Thank you. Thank you so much, sir.

I just want to add here, Jirag. You mentioned that we made an investment in these five units to a level of 342 crores, which has generated a revenue of 468 crores. So, if I was to add these businesses, this particular financial year, the investment will mean a revenue from 468, 342 would convert itself into maybe two and a half times in this year itself.

Okay, so two and a half times effect turnover ratio is what that kind of revenue potential is.

I'm being conservative, but that one seems very, very clear at this time.

Understood, sir. And just last question, and then I'll come back in the queue. In the overseas business, bearing the near-term commodity fluctuation, which you mentioned that eventually we should be able to get passed through, do we see any major headwinds? I mean, broadly, are we, let's say, done with the drag that we were seeing over the last few quarters in terms of overseas operation, and here onwards we should see?

Chirag, the difference between India and overseas is that the payment terms in our overseas business has a longer duration. So is the trigger mechanism for the pass through. So in India, it used to be three months. Now with some of the customers with the volatility that has been there, we are trying to convince them to do it within 30 days instead of 90 days. With the international business, that typical lineup is 180 days. While we are trying to talk to them and bring them also to a level of half that or maybe in three months, that lag and pass will take some time before it matches up to the speed of the change that happens in India. And therefore, we are anticipating that the volatility still continues. So, right now, the price at which we are selling is possibly the price or the cost of aluminium, which was more than four or five months away. The new one will become active now from the month of June onwards. So, that's the lag, and that lag obviously hurts us. But I'm very confident that with the lag now coming into place, the aluminium prices and the commodity prices seem to have peaked and are stabilizing. We should be able to match up to what we had projected in the beginning of the year in terms of our overseas operations.

Understood. And bearing commodity fluctuation, the overseas business, fundamentally, they are on a strong footing in terms of the improvement measures that we have undertaken.

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. So, if you saw a break-even, the idea was to break-even in the last quarter, which we had promised everyone we will and we have. The idea is to improve from there on and go into positive territory at the EBT level. So we were zero at the EBT level. We want to improve on the EBT level going forward, but this particular quarter that we are sitting in still carries the lag of the commodity, but once that is settled, we'll be back on our feet, strong and up.

Thank you. Thank you so much, sir, for the detailed answer. I'll come back in the queue.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, please press star and one. We take the next question from the line of Saket Kapoor from Kapoor and Company. Please go ahead.

Yeah. Namaskar, team. Thank you for this opportunity. Hope I'm audible, sir.

Yes, you are, Lou. Yes, you are audible, sir.

Yeah, my question is for Yashpal Ji. Yashpal Ji, we have closing working capital in progress at closing balance of 104 crore. So, how much will be getting capitalized and what is the capEx program for this work?

So, 115 crore, the flight number 12 that you are talking of, right?

I am looking at the balance sheet. I am looking at the consolidated balance sheet at closing balance at 104. Maybe you can continue, sir.

Sure. So, the first question is the working capital. Sorry, this capital working capital.

Yeah, closing balance is 104 crore. So, how much will get capitalized and what is our CapEx program for the current financial year?

So, like as we mentioned in our earlier participants' question, we expect our Sundaram Clayton project to get shifted by the second quarter of this year. So, part of that will be capitalized at that point of time. Secondly, the Khear City project will also be capitalized by end of quarter 2. So, major portion will be done away in terms of capitalization by the end of second quarter. In terms of Sanaswari also, it is at the end of quarter 2. So this is something revolving type of capital working process. New investments are done, it keeps on floating up. So while this figure will be capitalized by the end of second quarter, new figures might come in. And in the earlier calls, our chairman has mentioned that we keep our caps limited to 5 to 7 percent of our revenues. So, taking our revenue 15% growth on the current year's revenue, which is roughly 5,500 crores, you can expect a sum out capital outflow of 275 crores to around 310 crores for the upcoming financial year, which will include a part of growth capex, part of maintenance capex, part of upgradation capex required to upgrade our some old facilities also.

Right, right. As you alluded to a conservative number of 15% of revenue growth, and I think so earlier, there was also an EBITDA margin trajectory that was guided to us. So, where are we in terms of now the consolidated EBITDA margin that we may exhibit or our endeavor is for this current financial year? And we exited, I think, so at 11.08 for Q4 on a calculated level.

So, like, earlier we have discussed on our concourse that we also want to get into margins. And if you exclude the new projects, I think our performance has been very good this year also, in a consolidated basis also. And the new projects, the timelines we have set, so slide number 6 and slide number 7, I mean, we have tried to mention how we have performed in our new projects. And like as we discussed and we discussed in earlier calls also, every year we want to grow and improve our EBITDA levels by at least half a percent, in a range of half a percent, which could be 0.20, 0.30 or something like that. So this year also we are expecting to improve our EBITDA margins in a range of half a percent, which could be 0.1, 0.2, 0.34, depending on the market dynamics as far as address in the previous question. And the new projects, we have already given the timelines, but yes, new projects this year won't be up to that level that market is expecting because part of the year, they would be operational, part of the year, they would be in the commissioning stage. I hope that answers your question.

Right, so on a consolidated level, we did the exit of the year at 10.57. So, there is very likelihood that on the commissioning of the new project and also on the revisiting on the cost front for aluminium in particular, the margin should grow from this 10.57 level to a band of 0.25 to 0.5. That should be the understanding as of now.

Yeah, as we mentioned, we also have a desire to grow and improve, keep a healthy margin basket, but at the same time, you should also remember that we are executing some projects to keep the growth momentum. So, excluding the new projects that would be coming up, yes, we could expect a growth of 0.25% in EBITDA margins, but at the same time, the new projects, these would be in the commercial production, and new projects will be coming up during the current financials. So, it's a, I would say, ongoing process. One is finished, another is taken up, so that we keep on growing. As Sir has mentioned, that three to four.

Sir, your last point I missed out. Hello.

Yeah, so what I was saying is that yes, we are also, we also have a desire and expectations to improve our EBITDA margins by 0.25% for our existing projects. But in case of new projects would be some new, more new projects would be coming up in the current financial year. Which would again have a profitability and turn around two years of another one and a half years to two years time. So this is a process, continuous process, I would say, a revolving process which keeps on going. But the new projects are very well for us to achieve a growth in the margins as well as the revenues also. And every three to four years, as our chairman sir has mentioned, we want to just double our revenues up.

Yeah. Okay. And lastly, sir, between the case mix, yeah, I joined the queue.

Yeah, yeah.

Thank you. Thank you.

We take the next question from the line of Ashutosh Tiwari from Aquarius Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hi. Congress on good set our numbers. Firstly, you talked about that for new projects, you can do 2.5x revenue on investments in this year. Correct number? So can we do it in the code plus from their side?

You mean to say two and a half percent of the revenues we could do from the current inch?

Yeah, I think it was mentioned by sir that from the US$42 crores on new projects, you can do two and half its revenue this year. Is it correct?

Yeah, yeah. It is possible that is correct. We expect to do so.

So this whole six years of revenue that we did this year can go to 800 crores plus in effort 27.

Two and a half percent, you can take 700, 750 crores, I think. I mean, it's a range for us given, two and a half times, which can be two to two and a half times, basically, I would say. So around 750 crores of everything, these projects can do 460, they have already delivered up.

But as I mentioned, Ashutosh, Ashutosh, there is a two-way sword here, in some sense. What I mentioned earlier, that there is every likelihood that this year would call for a price-free trigger. So, the overall concept of revenue will also grow with the increase in prices that we will charge the customers for all our existing products. This has happened because, see, at one point of time, it was only commodities. But this particular year, there has every level of costing and input has gone up. And therefore, the entire industry will recalibrate in some sense.

Okay. Okay. So, and we had a marginal EBITDA. Yeah.

Yeah, please go ahead. Where? Marginal EBITDA where?

I was saying that you had a margin EBITDA loss this year. So with this kind of growth in revenue, will you make good profits from this, like not good, but not company level, but will you make decent profit from this new business?

Yes, absolutely. So, we will obviously improve the margins. We will have to wait and see how it affects on the EBD stage. But do remember that while these will turn around to a large degree, where I think it's written in the presentation as to when they will turn around, the Sundaram Clayton business will turn around in quarter three, Cape City in quarter two, Sanaswari in quarter two. The EV business, we are saying financial year 28, Romania and financial year 28, but besides of these, there is also growth that is happening, and that growth is happening in several areas with several new products. So, like Yashpalji said, it's a continuous dynamic scenario that we are going through if we have to meet and prepare for the growth that we have in mind of doubling our revenue every three to four years. So, there will be something in a project stage, there will be something in a loss stage, there will be something in a turnaround stage, and at the same time, we are making an endeavor that our business, which are established and stable, keep improving on the margins, for which a 0.25% increase, like Yashpazi has said, is what is being targeted. I hope I'm... This has clarified a lot of things too, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And Amosad Luminum Syndrome created this year for the full year?

It was 369 crore, sir.

Okay. And secondly, you alluded to the sign that because of aluminum price increase, there'll be some margin pressure, maybe in Q&A in the overseas business. Will there be marginal inflation in India business as well in Q1 because of this increase in the oil and oil?

Yes, there is. There is. We've suffered some loss on account of that. But we are hopeful now with the new prices kicking in, unless they go up again, the prices, we should be able to get that benefit in the current period.

So, India business, the increase has already happened in this quarter, like, say, from May, or May, basically, or it will happen in the lag in India as well?

See, a large part of the increase happened in the month of March and April. April was the worst affected. So, April pass-throughs will start from the month of June, in that quarter. Yeah, so take a lag of three months, typically, as to how it happens in India. Like I said, we are talking to the customers now to make it more proactive and not do it three-month basis. I think the entire industry is talking to the customers saying that this needs to be done every month. It hasn't happened so far, but we are hopeful that something could happen.

Okay, got it, got it. Okay, that's all for myself. Thank you so much.

Thank you. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Aditya Kontawar from Complete Circle Capital. Please go ahead.

Hi, Team Sandhar. First of all, big congratulations on the execution that you guys have done in the past four years. I think in a single quarter of Q4, FY26, you guys have done more PAC than the entire full year PAC of FY22. So, good news for that. Thank you for the commentary that you gave at the start of the call. I just wanted to ask you, I mean, at the end of FY30 or FY31, is it safe to assume that Sundar will do a pat-off anywhere of 150 to 200 crores? And what are the margins that we are aspiring towards? That's my first question.

I don't understand. 150 crores in 2030? Is that what I heard?

Yeah, yeah. Basically, you did your entire year's pack after four years. So, I wanted to ask whether you can do the same in the next four years.

Are you saying every quarter? Yeah, yeah. Well, I think, Yashpalji, what is our projection? Do you want to give some... Yeah, yeah, sure.

So, like Aditya, we have, as far as mentioned, three to four years, we want to double our revenue. So, in case we touch 10,000 crores of mark. We would expect that our return on capital employed sees an improvement because we are more focusing on return on capital employed as the volumes will grow up because the percent of margin is a limiting factor for us in terms of EBITDA and EBITDA, but we are targeting an improvement return on capital employed starting with a post-tax return of 15 percent going something at a highest peak of 20 percent. So, in that scenario, you can expect that on a 10,000 crores of revenue, we could be in a position to generate a pet of around 450 crores, something around that, to achieve that return on capital employed. This is how we expect.

So, and any EBITDA margin guidance, sir?

EBITDA, as you know, that we, I mean, manufacturing a diversified product of die-casting, locks and mirrors, I mean, assembly as well as manufacturing. So, while EBITDA levels will remain constant, I would, around 11%, but with the volumes coming up and the revenue growing up, automatically, in terms of absolute returns, our multiplier will be giving us more return on capital imports, so more of a cash with us in that term. So, at that point of time, the percent margins won't be of much importance in terms of EBITDA or EBITDA, and more focus would be on how to generate more absolute margins, and the focus going forward is again on ROE and ROCE, basically. So, even if you have an EBITDA of, I mean, 11% you can take on 10,000 crores, close to 1100 crores, you can expect to greater return, never so, getting to 20% post-rex.

Sure.

Let me just supplement it and give you some supplement to this. With whatever commentary I have given you in the beginning, where we've said that the revenue will grow by double every three to four years, it is safe to assume that the bottom line will improve better than that. Right? Yeah. Correct. So, that should give you, if you are sitting at 200 odd draws, the number that Yashpazi has given you of 450 seems quite safe. Sure.

So, my second question was on debt, you know, the near-term guidance on debt and the long-term guidance. So, even if you don't give me absolute numbers, just a commentary on debt-to-equity ratios that we are aspiring towards. Thank you.

Yeah, sure. So, like, in terms of debt levels, if you refer to a slide number 14, so, I mean, we have a net debt of 897 crores and a gross debt of 948 crores, and largely out of that content of 948, 564 is working capital debt, largely linked to the revenue size, right, because the receivables are normally 45 days, while the payables are even somewhat shorter period during this crisis as we sit on today. So, I mean, the term loans are 384 crores, which will be automatically paid with the due schedules. This year, we have a repayment commitment of around close to 103 crores with various banks. So, term debt will start pairing as the repayment schedule comes in, but as working capital debt is aligned directly to the business. So, I don't think that is a point of worry. What we are borrowing is directly dependent on what we are earning and what we are selling to the customers. It's directly linked to the business part. Some loans automatically start to shut down and tear down in next 3 to 4 years, unless a new project comes in, because as I told, it is a going process. If a new project comes up, a greenfield project comes up again, we will be doing a fresh borrowing as mandated in the RGA covenants also, 25-75 or whatever the ratios required. But working capital loan will be continuing as per the business cycle. I hope that is okay. And even today, the debt equity ratio is fairly good for us. If we compare with another industry competitor, we are sitting on a very healthy debt equity ratio. Thank you and all the best. Thank you very much.

Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shashank from ICIC Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, thanks for the question. You know, you mentioned about entering the telematics kind of technology space. So any head stuff we have in terms of any joint ventures you're supposed to do or, you know, something we've done on the R&D side, if you can throw some light.

Mm-hmm.

Jeejay, you want to take that question?

Yeah, sir. So, hi. Good morning. So, on your question, yes, we are definitely working on these product lines, and as you mentioned earlier, meetings also, we are very, very ahead of... You know, those discussions with the partners in, you know, for those technologies, and also in-house development of those products in our R&D center. So we feel that these products are going to be presented to the potential customers going forward. We have actually started presenting them to the customers, and this is a very good response from the customers, and now we are going to the next level of creating some POCs. And submitting them, and then things will take, you know, way forward. So, we feel that these, this year, current financial year, these are going to be informed or, you know, showcased to the customers. And next year, we feel that this should come into the development cycle, and then from the development, it will move to the production cycle.

Shashan, just adding to that, we are not looking at joint ventures at this time. We are considering transfer of technology or collaborations, which will be on the royalty basis rather than in the form of joint ventures. We want to use the infrastructure that we have already within the platform instead of creating more. What we will do, we will do it on the basis of incremental capital costs using our existing infrastructure, so that the return on capital employed and the return and margins come much faster than they typically do in the preparation of joint matches.

Sir, given that the industry is moving towards this technology space, so do we expect community to expedite their, you know, look for a technology transfer kind of a thing in the near future, or do you see that as a, you know, three, four years kind of a story to plan out for some of that technologies?

We are already in the process. I am not at Liberty State, but we have identified some prospective partners. Who should be able to give us the technology that we seek. But of course, for finalization of that, we need to go ahead from the customers who, like DJ just said, the customers have it under consideration. We are having discussions, and as soon as we can lock in the kind of technology that is apt. It is attributable to the Indian industry. We will log it with that particular corresponding partner and take that to the market within the next 12 months.

Sure. Is there any update on the SmartKey project? So has the penetration kind of increased or has it got more acceptance from customers?

No, no, no. It is growing. Right now it is growing. I think we've reached a level, if I'm not mistaken, it could be 10% up or down. I don't know daily numbers. But we've reached a level of about 5,000 lock sets per month. And it's growing. The volumes are growing every month.

Right, right. And so lastly, our top plan is most covered in paper of tubulets, right? So it's gradually increased from 60 to 67%. So traditionally, should we think of this line or traditionally, as a company, are you thinking of diversifying your revenues more towards tangible things like PBA or other line items?

We run after opportunities, young man. So whether they appear in the two-wheeler market or the four-wheeler market or the construction market or the tractor market, we are quite agnostic to it. See, we have the capital that we can employ is limited, and wherever we feel that we will get traction, at this stage, at this time, the two-wheeler market is going very rapidly, and we are very well-trenched with our customers. And therefore, their dependency on us is an opportunity we don't want to lose. It is quite possible, and we continue to work on new technologies. We continue to work with new customers, including several four-wheeler ones. As and when we get the breakthroughs in those technologies with those customers, obviously, we are in the game. And there is every likelihood that the share of four-wheelers and other aspects of the auto industry will grow as a percentage to our revenue. But are we just doing that? No, the answer is no. When the opportunities today are in the two-wheelers stage, we will not take the opportunity just because our percentage to that or our exposure to that particular category will become more.

Understood, sir. Thank you so much for the explanation, and wish you all the best.

Thank you.

Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajit Agarwal from Neil Giri Advisors. Please go ahead.

Good morning, sir. Thanks for the opportunity to ask the question. If, just first off, a quick clarification on the consolidated balance sheet numbers. So, there is a total debt number of 41 million euros, and this is as per slide number 8 of the presentation. Q4F525, Overseas Business, Outstanding Borrowings are 41 million euros, and Q4F526 is 46.9 million euros. And if I look at the INR crore numbers for the same head, The number has increased from 380 to 506 crores, which is 126 crores. So, is that correct? I mean, 5 million euros leading to an increase of 120 crores?

I'll answer this question. So, I mean, there is not an increase in the absolute debt. Earlier, the thing is that if you know, I mean, while presenting the financials, earlier we were into bill discounting mode in overseas operation, which was proving to be costly for us. And bill discounting as per the standards, IFRS and Indian accounting standards, they are clubbed with the current liability. While we have shifted those bills paywalls or I would say bill discounting to a clean debt because it was economical for us. So that is the reason, as per the standards, it is now a part of the borrowings, and shown in the borrowings. So this is how the increase has been now.

I'm sorry, sir, but what you are saying is, in the Euros and in Rupees, I mean, the difference should be the same, right? Euro, million and INR crores.

It happens that we are presenting our financials into a group currency which is the Indian rupees. Today the euro is reporting at around 111 rupees per ILR. It was around 108 rupees in the month of March, whereas two years back it was around 90 rupees. So when you re-convert the finances as per the accounting standards, you need to take the closing rates. While our commitments are in Euro itself, they are repayable in Euro. So this is not something mean-to-mean you can, I mean, classify or directly convert. At each, every balance sheet date or each reporting date, we have to take the closing rates. It's the main data.

Understood. So the increase in the notion of value

because it's been converted to Indian rupees. In effect, it is to be serviced by the overseas operations, which will continue to be in Euros. I hope it goes.

If it goes like 90 rupees again, this INR content will again come down to that extent.

So overall increase is 5 million euros.

Yeah, 5 million is a portion that we have shifted from bill discounting to a clean debt. So, largely, they are regrouping the balance sheet heads itself. There is a little increase, I would not delay, around half a million, we have done a fresh borrowing over there to meet their commitments.

Understood. Okay. Now, on the working capital, if I look at your working capital overall, the inventory, the receivables, number of days have gone up as of end of March 2026. And a large part of that increase, it seems has come from overseas subsidiaries or your Indian subsidiaries either way. So, any thoughts around that, sir?

I mean, I was looking to bring that down for now. Yeah, so slide, you must be referring slide number 12, right? So, it is, as a consolidated level, it is 44 days, standalone 51. There is some one-time receipts that we got. Because of that, the cycle has gone up. Otherwise, the normal receivable cycle is 40 to 45 days itself. Inventory holding period is also from 54 to 55 days, because in overseas, we are required to carry a large chunk of inventory compared to Indian operations. Otherwise, in Indian operations, we are not even carrying an inventory of more than 12 to 13 days. This is the, I mean, the movement of inventory right now. So, I don't think it's going to rise. The receivables would be in a period of collection period of 40 to 45. And technically, if you see, if you go for a bill discounting, this would come down. But right now, it's costly. So, that's the reason. It's more of an accounting presentation, I would say. If you go for a British accounting, automatically the receiver goes out of your books, sir. And it goes to the current language. So, this is a scenario. But on a normal basis, it is 40 to 40.

Understood, sir. All right.

Thank you so much.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, please press star and one. We take the next question from the line of Mihir Damania from Fident AMC. Please go ahead.

Yeah, hi. So, my first question pertains to the overseas business. So, if you look on a full-year basis, it has been grown by around 8.5% in Euro terms. 46 million Euro revenue, a similar amount of debt. If we are taking like a three to five year view, how do we actually... What is the strategy going there? Of course, you've seen that you have shifted some of the plans, but even on growth, even on debt, because almost half of your debt sits outside of India. So, we just wanted to understand more on a strategic perspective, what value does this add to the overall organization, whether this is a business? Where we are probably going to deploy a lot more capital, what's the strategic outlook over here?

If I understand correctly, you're asking the justification for us and our overseas business, right?

I would, yeah, and the strategic outlook of where you see the business over the next two to three years.

Yeah, so you're aware that, you know, Europe markets and American markets haven't done as well as India has. In the meantime, from what started off with the Ukraine war and the increase in prices of gas, which went up 800 percent, obviously the margins have been affected since then for the last few years. There is stability that is now being brought into the entire system, but for us, the strategic call is not about the business. It's about having your presence overseas. Because all the customers are now moving to India. And if you have your legs overseas, their dependence on companies even supplying from India. To give you an example, some of the big majors who are our customers gave us business in India, which is now becoming stable and mature. It's largely because of the fact that we had experience dealing with them overseas. So we were suppliers to them overseas, and now they feel that we can do it from India. So I think there has been reference there. There has been relevance there. And also, the last couple of years, while your question is very valid, because our investment and our return on capital employees falls dramatically on account of our overseas business, and we've considered and reconsidered whether we should keep it or not, the fact that it was in losses made it even more difficult for us to take any strategic calls. Now that we are hopeful that this particular year, we would have all those sins washed away. We will re-look at this business, but at this point of time, it is very difficult for me to comment. As to what is likely to happen before the end of the year.

Okay, well, thank you. And my second question relates to one of our anchor customers has highlighted like a major supply chain challenge in the month of April. Is that behind us? Does it impact us in some way or form? Or do you think that was just a temporary flip and business will be as usual in the beginning?

Well, you know, the biggest problems that we faced in the month of April were, let's say, the availability of gas. The availability of raw materials, especially aluminum, and then the most serious became the availability of MANPASS. From the time of Holi and then subsequent elections that happened in Bengal and Assam and then everywhere in Tamil Nadu, at one point of time, the entire auto industry was grappling with an absenteeism of almost 20% with the... And there on announcements of various state governments increasing the minimum wages by almost 30 to 40 percent. And yesterday, Karnataka giving an indication that that could be even higher than 50 percent. Obviously, there is a lot of restlessness in the market on availability of manpower. So we as a company... I'm trying to make the best possible out of this scenario. But as an industry, whether it is TVS Motors, whether it is Hero, whether it is Honda, or whether it is anybody else, or the entire industry, according to my understanding, would have lost somewhere in the region of almost 200,000 to 300,000 vehicles. And that reflects in the inventory, which has come down dramatically. If you look at the two-wheelers, some of the customers who used to have a 60-day stock in the market is now to less than 14 days. So there is demand. I said that in the beginning. It continues to be very, very robust irrespective of the challenges that there are on a global scale. But for us, while these challenges are there, it's not individualized as a company. This is for the entire sector. Things are improving as we speak. The month of May is better than what it was in April, and I'm hopeful that by the end of June, irrespective of anything else except maybe some dramatic stuff that happens on a global scale, we should be back to work as normal.

Got it.

Perfect.

Thank you and I'll do this.

Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Jaya Prakash from Corbin Capital. Please go ahead.

Hi, sir, I just, I've been following your company, and you have been executing really well, and you work with us in good marketing style.

A little louder, Jayaprakash? Can you speak a little louder?

Yeah, yeah, let's hear if I'm harder than that. Am I harder than that? So, my question is, basically, I'm trying to assess your franchise, right? So, I look at your business sheet, Michael, and women are diecasting our majority of your business, right? So, I want to understand your differentiation. Is it the size which differentiates you that competition cannot come in? That's the first question. And second question is, there you are, and this is when you say growth is like 15% growth, right, there you have been conservative writing 15%. And I think we'll be outperforming the industry. So where this confidence comes from, does it come from the new products like smart logs? I think you talked about backing chargers, which is kind of a new product, right? So if you can explain your right to win, I know smart logs, I think there's a couple of clicks. But backing charger, if you can explain where you are in terms of the complicated positions, and how does, where your confidence of the 50% growth comes from, right? Is it from existing?

Let me put one thing aside, which is, you said, EV products. The EV products are still very, very insignificant to the entire company. Even if you are going from a 20 crore revenue to a 40 crore revenue, you would appreciate that that number is extremely small in the context of the size. The EV business is that we are trying to now work as we become a little on scale. We should be able to Negative portion or the bottom line to the best extent possible in this particular year. When you talk about castings, for example, yes, we have several USPs. One USP comes from the international business that we have, which was to make spools. Now, these are thin-walled, machine-less castings, which are not done at open or by everybody in the country here, number one. Number two, with the acquisition of the Sundaram Clayton business, we become an integrated player in the casting scenario. You are aware that in the year before that, we had bought over the machining business from TVS as well. With that happening, now we do both high-pressure diecasting, we do low-pressure diecasting, we do machining, and the entire context of not just small components, but from small to extremely large, including engine blocks. So the size, scale, the flexibility across the supply chain in the aluminum business has gone up dramatically. So we are an integrated player, and that in itself is a big USP for us to grow, and the opportunities are showing very, very openly for us, because now people want, as our customers want to consolidate. In terms of their supplier base, we fall in line with someone who can give them from zero to a hundred in terms of whatever their requirements of casting are. At the same time, you're also aware that we are possibly the only player who also does zinc casting. We also do magnesium casting. So anybody who wants any kind of casting is now available with Sandar in every sense of the world. Hello, you wanted growth. You wanted growth, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So in terms of growth, at this time, the three major verticals... Which is aluminum business, sheet metal business, the proprietary business, and in fact, even the construction business. All of them are rated at growth rates for this particular year, which are probably internally much higher than what I've quoted you. I have been a little conservative. I said that right in the beginning. That is because of a little bit of confusion as to how this year would pan out. Depending on global case scenarios and India case scenarios, but the overall growth estimate that I'm giving you seems conservative, and I also said it was without taking into preview the pricing re-trigger that is likely to happen. So it's across every division and every product line that we manufacture that we are looking at the growth rates that I've told you.

Great, sir. Great, sir. And, sir, just a follow-up question, because you mentioned that you work with zinc, magnesium, aluminum, right? And I heard another officer, he talks about that they are able to really process these zinc, magnesium, and a few other things, and that's how they were able to move up the value chain in terms of getting into aerospace. So, I'm sure you have enough on your plate right now, but anything in terms of the future guidance where you want to see yourself, do you want to expand the sectors you cater to or take these existing capabilities to anywhere else within the auto itself, if you can just comment.

You know, that's a very big question. That's a very big question. It depends on the opportunity that is presented to us. Like I said, in terms of building our capability, that's what we are doing from 0 to 100. Obviously, whether it is aerospace, whether it is defense, whether it is railways, whether it is auto, the present case scenario of what our capabilities are in casting, we cover it all. We are obviously concentrating on the existing customers that we have and the existing businesses that we have, where the volume play and the volume growth affords us to be busy for this particular year. But this is not taking away from the fact that we are very open to looking at various other possibilities, and as and when something strikes, and we will keep you posted. Good, sir.

Thanks a lot.

Ladies and gentlemen, we take that as the last question and conclude the question and answer session. I now hand the conference over to the management for their closing comments.

Once again, I just want to thank you all. Just telling you, informing you, and congratulating you that your company at this time is in solid stead. We are in a happy place. India is in a happy place. Our sector is in a happy place. And unless and until barring anything major that happens outside, And on the global horizon, we seem quite confident that this year will also be a year where we will have record numbers show up for the entire year. With that, thank you once again. Thank you to Dollars Capital for putting this together. And I look forward to speaking to you again after the next quarter. Thank you very much. Bye-bye. Thank you and bye-bye.

On behalf of Dollar Capital Markets Private Limited, that concludes this conference call. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.